JCESU

Read this.....

http://www.washingtoncitypaper.com/display.php?id=34512

They forgot "Z" as in xerox...and I thought that state of the art comm center was in Pepsi Cola, Florida not D.C.

Its a sad commentary on the state of Public Safety in that cheaper isn't awlays better. We have the same thing here. People that cannot formulate a complete sentence dealing with people's lives during the worst event of their life and trying to pretend they know what they are talking about over the radio (some don't even pretend). Good article though...

What about those who take "peanutbutterball" for their seizures?

That is correct-I heard some of the peanutbutterball may be laceded with amtrax.

The AED of choice for delivery men worldwide.

Does the AMA allow that UPS to be used on a PT that has 'SICKASHELL ANEMIA'?

I have to give kudos to everyone that has participated in this discussion so far as it relates to the original topic. Many good points and counter-points were made that myself (and I hope others) will use in the future in dealing with these situations. I am pretty confident that these are the types of discussions that the site wants to promote. As for the disposition of the case..I guess we'll just have to tune in and find out. STAY SAFE

Could the PI Officer escort the press over the line, let them take pictures and ask a few questions, than escort them back? I would think that the PI officer would be a great assett ( sorry spelling) to any dept, Fire police or EMS, so that they can coordinate the press at large scale events and the press can still do their jobs.

Most Cities and Towns, at least in NJ, have PIO's for such situations-not always at scenes though-obviously depending on place, time and circumstances. Paterson does have a PIO. If the Photographer was professional as the Record claims then I have to imagine she would have been aware of this and established a rapport with the PIO. In JC if the PIO or an Officer is going to escort a person passed the line, for whatever reason, then usually it is put over the air for all to know and hear so there aren't any issues. But they aren't brought into an area where danger exists and they stay with them for safety and security reasons until they leave. If there isn't a PIO clearly available I would suggest grabbing a Police Supervisor and explaining your situation. If its presented in the right manner and it doesn't deplete resources or create a safety issue you may be extended some courtesy to achieve your goal.

If I have past experiences with a person from the media and they have given me a hard time, crossed the line etc., of course I am gonna pay special attention to them if they arrive at a scene-because of their past actions and that they have zero credibiltiy. Thats one of the things I am sworn to do. The media always waves the constituiton when they do something wrong-but that gets old quickly when people with logic and good common sense examine the facts.

Good luck with your photo taking.

OK- Chris and JCESU- You guys can slap the cuffs on me at the next fire scene I show up at to do my job. But you have to do it from two blocks away. Sound "Reasonable"?

We all know that these scenes are controlled chaos at best. Which can turn ugly in the blink of an eye. Its not about a silly arrest(DP) which is gonna take the Officer off the road for a few hours and amount to nothing but aggravation. But when in all probability, you have a large group of people on one side of the tape, and ONE Officer, to keep the scene safe and clear because resources are already stretched thin. What do you think the crowd is gonna do when the see one (or more) people cross the tape and the Officer does nothing? The mind set of the crowd is gonna be-BS if she can do it why can't get we closer? And now you have a scene that is uncontrolled chaos and the firefighters can't do their job and care to the victim(s) is compromised because you have civilians standing in your way. Everyone would like a front row seat, myself included, but not at the cost of bringing more danger to an already dangerous job. The Supreme Court had ruled years ago that the media had a right, or even an obligation, to report an unbiased , factual account to the community, things that effect them. But not so when an inherent danger exists to a third party that otherwise wouldn't exist in the first place or that risk is now increased by their actions.

Don't be silly- I said legitimate media. Those trained and experienced in covering the news. With that job comes an implied assumption of risk covering news events- same as a cop or firefighter, risks that professional journalists are well aware of. I don't see police tape up in Iraq or Afghanistan.

Who decides who and what is the "legitimate media"? I have pen, pad and camera with me all the time. Does that mean I can walk into any scene and do whatever I want. In fact I feel an overwhelming sense of Journopathichillaryness coming on right now.

Well, if she is a so-called "professional" and felt her rights were being stomped on by those terrible POLICE OFFICERS there are channels for her argument. Perhaps calling for the Police Supervisor etc. Not commiting an unlawful act. One of the elements the courts look at when deciding such issues is "what is reasonable" and in this case I am sure they will find that the Officer and the perimeter tape were both reasonable. If the Police didn't take precautions and set-up the tape so idiots like her don't get injured during such emergencies they would be accused of malfesance. She wanted her way, didn't like being told no and was held responsible for her actions. I honestly don't understand what the problem is...Of course if the Police set up Crime Scene tape outside your house and arrest you for obstructing that would be unreasonable. But this is not the case in this situation. The Officer acted in good faith plain and simple. Most in law enforcement have dealt with the media. In my fourteen years I have had hundreds of interactions with the media, most if not all were positive, having made many good friends along the way. I assure you there are many ways to make a name for yourself-this isn't one of them.

She must have thought the Police line was a suggestion....

Wow, talking about old shows, did anyone ever watch "True Blue" the show about NYC's Police Emergency Service Unit, what late 80's?

Wow thats a blast from the past! I could only find the stats on the show online nothing further...wouldn't mind checking out the video.

Seth,

I see what your getting at.... take a look at the FLSA (we all fall under the 7K provision) that should help you out some. In addition, regardless of what time you get payed from, 'past practice', also plays an extremely significant roll in determining when your on duty. Especially for collective bargaining and legal issues. Rick

UNION UNION UNION

The major problem I see within EMS is a lack of solidarity and Unionization. Until EMS bands together and becomes a strong Union the idea of salaries, benefits and other perks will remain. Without collective bargaining and a lobbyist your just spinng your wheels. Fraternal organizations and the like are great but that is not going to improve your working conditions. Fighting for fair contracts for decades is the only reason the PD and fd have the benefits they receive and it is a constant battle to maintain our working conditions let alone improve them let alone improve them.

A bad day to say the least.

How do you guys feel about having on board video cams in the trucks. Especially for incidents such as this one.

(12/06/07) HOBOKEN - The emergency room at Hoboken University Medical Center was briefly shut down Thursday after a teen allegedly brought a homemade bomb into the building.

A mother reportedly brought her son into the hospital after she noticed he was working on a project in his room. According to hospital spokesperson Joan Quigley, that project contained turpentine and spark plugs. Quigley says the mother gave the device to a nurse, who called the bomb squad.

The emergency room was shut down for 90 minutes during the incident. The 15-year-old is undergoing a psychiatric evaluation.

(from news 12 NJ)

_____________________________

anyone know if this has any truth to it?

i wonder why thin day in age, hospitals do have at least metal detectors???

Yes its fairly accurate. We were sent there and our tech's removed the package without incident. Wish we could have left our tech's there for a check up from the neck up.

There are allot of problems with HPD aside from the pictures. The lion's share is attributed to politics. And we know how that goes-the liitle guy gets the short straw. These pictures are just the latest in a firestorm of lawsuits and transfers etc. Admittedly these pictures were a serious lapse of judgement.I am told that the weapons are privately owned by the officers-this still doesn't negate the responsibility or lack there of,but, what is interesting is the timing of the release of the pic's. At the end of the day the department is left with a black eye. The dismatling of the unit, IMO, is a serious lapse in judgement. Even if they are called out once a year they serve a purpose. They aren't an ESU, but a part-time swat unit. They are on patrol and respond when needed. JCPD -ESU is called into Hoboken often enough for our own jobs that take us there as well as to assist HPD. But we have enough work on our own as an ESU to be thought of as white knights for the politicians in the mile square. One of the more critical issues is that they went to LA on their own accord. Departments that were sent down to LA were done as "Mutual Aid" via NJSP and sworn in as LE in LA. Had any of these guys gone down there and taken any action i.e, involved in a shooting, made an arrest or even detained somone, the Officers would have been subjected to the laws of LA as any private citizen would have if they have done the same. Not only would they have been civil litigants but criminally liable as well. A serious issue to say the least even though they may have had the best of intentions.You guys raised some really good questions for not being that savvy with LE it makes you wonder what the command structure was thinking by allowing this to happen.Some may make the argument that they were ordered to go down to LA, but, it would have been an UNLAWFUL ORDER, and should not have been obeyed. This would be one of the rare moments they could have told the boss to go scratch.Ignorance is not a defense. Stay safe

Given the size of the truck there is a good chance the driver didn't realize he made contact with the parked vehicle. That would be subject to interpretation of the video. If in fact the vehicle was illegally parked is of no consequence. The law stipulates that any vehicle in motion involved in an accident will remain at the scene and all atempts to preserve same will be taken. Regardless of SOP's of any agency. In a case like this I would have to imagine that the driver of the apparatus would be issued a summons for leaving the scene and let a judge decide the fate.

In most cases common sense must prevail. If you are involved in a minor MVA on the turnpike, in the left lane (passing lane), then I would move all vehicles as practical to the shoulder. In this situation, had the vehicle operator known he made contact, then he had an obligation to remain on scene. Especially in cases of Gov't owned vehicles. This way the owner of the struck vehicle cannot claim more damges than were made or personal injuries. And it also preserves the accident so it can be memorialized via photographs and diagrams for later claims and debate. I strongly suggest nothing be moved.

I have heard all the excuses about not wearing seatbelts in radio cars. I don't agree with them at all. In an ESU wagon I think its actually more comfortable and holds you in place.In the ESU Mack its either head trauma or seatbelt. The only time I wouldn't is enroute to a pre-planned tac-job.BTW most cars/trucks do have instructions in the owners manual to disengage the belt minder BELL.

HOLY COW.....THAT MADE THE HAIR STAND UP ON THE BACK OF MY NECK

What about the use of a Cushman (Hotdog cart) or Go-4? Would provide allot more room for equipment and user comfort.

Hey if thay can make pink handcuffs for on duty LE.......

Hey can you tell me what th OSHA class is about? Thanks

When I worked out of a precinct we were made to go with them when they raided the local bodegas for fraudulent films. Most of the guys I dealt with were FBI alumni. A different breed compared to your average street cop. Not in a negative way.....just different. And you had to act accordingly.

Perhaps they should be given a real reason to ride to CB in a bus....j/k (but not really)

The CSI phenomenon is cause to make you vomit when you are off on a job and people are asking when CSI is arriving to (insert technological wonder here). Its not enough with multi tasking with limited resources in the middle of the night so I guess people have to exlpain to us how to do our job. What would we do without these people. Don't know if I could get through a tour! I would like to meet David Caruso someday so I can give him a big foot in the bum. So just add the TV/Film industry to the list of reasons the jury pools are able to arrive at jury nullification and let the mutants walk.

I agree with allot of what Seth had stated. For those Medics/EMT's that are career oriented slaries in the $20-$26 per hr. range are offered if you are willing to swim across the river to UMDNJ and The Jersey City Medical Center. They are both extremely busy agencies and are what I would consider top shelf in my experiences in handling jobs with them. The benefits are also pretty fair as well. The JCMC works 12's but I am not exactly sure about University in Newark. Both of them are definitely worth checking out and are always recruiting.

Rick

Yeah, the FDNY hourly sucks at $14 for the first year; but the pension, LODI benefits, health insurance, and job security are a big bonus. I'll be honest I don't really know much about the compensation packages offered by the voluntaries, but I do know a few employee's of St. Vincents and Cabrini who are pissed and out of a job. If I get hurt at work I don't have to do deal with the comp board. I've been there and I am grateful I'll never have to go through it again.

Something I forgot earlier is the possibility of 12 hour tours coming. That mens every other weekend off, built in over time, and 16(?) fewer appearances each year. From what I understand both sides want 12 hour tours, its just a matter of the details and convincing the Labor Relations Board that its a good idea. Why thats an issue is beyond me.