Atv300

Ok so you have a smoke charged room from a waste paper basket fire your fast dosnt get out your twiddling your thumbs ok 5mins not getting out call the next one 15mins out travel and dispatch time. Fire doubles in size every 30 seconds how big is it by the time you needed fast team is there. You made the statment fast is gospel on interior attacks so don't pick and choose your waiting with 10 ffs out side after the statement of no building should be left to burn for safety reasons who's the one with an issue here. I love how ones oppinion turns into a personal attack I am just stating in othere departments with a great group of ffs guess what fast is none existent and between them and there neibors they put out the same fires "remember we are firemen". Your prolly one of those kind of guys that wouldn't know what to do without a hydrent and 17 departments on first alarm to make the fire easy for you.

Please excuse the spelling and grammar I am on my cell at work.

No matter what everyones tactics are the end result needs to be the same everyone goes home.

Wow I don't know if you cannot read or what but that is my mindset you notice I said if and depending on man power if you cannot protect your guys stay defensive dont go in that is always an option I do not care what building it is I do not and will never hold that higher then my team so next time read first then comment. I was simply stating some people get caught up on the fast team instead of adapting and over coming the issue what we as ffs should be able to do no matter what.

That's why I said use your own guys I just think Some people get stuck on the fast team and forget you can have 2out with guys on scene.

This may have been accomplished on-scene, so I'm not pointing fingers. This is just to reiterate the concept.

One more time:

Fast (RIT, MAT) Must be established prior to anyone entering an ILDH atmosphere (the building). The minimum is 2 in 2 out. Fast must be continuous until the atmosphere is no longer ILDH.

Fast is part of the fire control team. You wouldn't even think of starting a baseball game without an outfield. Too much can go wrong.

I am not going to get involved with the other questions because i don't know the area, details on the incedent, or operating procedures of the departments.

But the fast quest while I agree FAST/RIT teams are a great resource some times I wounder if people get caught up in the allure of the FAST teams role. Staffing in your department and your neighbor's department is something you have to consider on scene and before the incident how you are going to handle the quick decision's that will have to be made for any thing that is thrown at you. Yes you should try to fallow the laws to a tee the best you can but with this law remember the way its written 2in 2out IE you need enough man power on the out side able to go in to get them yes its nice having a team dedicated to this but if you cant having interior ffs standing by to go in will work. My question is you get on scene to an active fire big small what every you want to imagine you have enough manpower to make an aggressive attack k/d the fire and have extra guys on the out side ready to go in setting up ladders fans whatever close to the building (which from my understanding is allowed not only by fast teams but in the 2in/2out). Your FAST team is not getting out do you stop and say hey we can't fight this fire until we find a FAST team or do you set up ops and have a team of your own guys doing the same things that I mentioned above and say there your 2in/2out, fires out and everyones safe? An IC/chief will always have those kinds of decisions to make and this IC might have made this call.

And when they become a chief or IC for that matter they too will have to follow the law and comply with the respiratory standard (2in 2out).

Same thing as above who knows this chief might have still been fallowing 1910.134.

From the US department of labor page OSHA.

"1910.134(g)(4)

Procedures for interior structural firefighting. In addition to the requirements set forth under paragraph (g)(3), in interior structural fires, the employer shall ensure that:

1910.134(g)(4)(i)

At least two employees enter the IDLH atmosphere and remain in visual or voice contact with one another at all times;

1910.134(g)(4)(ii)

At least two employees are located outside the IDLH atmosphere; and

1910.134(g)(4)(iii)

All employees engaged in interior structural firefighting use SCBAs.

Note 1 to paragraph (g): One of the two individuals located outside the IDLH atmosphere may be assigned to an additional role, such as incident commander in charge of the emergency or safety officer, so long as this individual is able to perform assistance or rescue activities without jeopardizing the safety or health of any firefighter working at the incident.

Note 2 to paragraph (g): Nothing in this section is meant to preclude firefighters from performing emergency rescue activities before an entire team has assembled."

I often wounder sometimes what people think when they post comments on article like this. Most of the comments I read through sounded spot on why appoint someone who has jack for experience in the county over many applicants with years and years of emergency response experience around the county. I was reading through one of the comments the person was running their mouth about the county cars, as always some people might not seem to pull weight but I know lots of the guys who "volunteer" their time and help with some of the biggest issues that face the county and there departments once again for no pay check. I don't know maybe I am just bias but hey those guys are there to help you and your departments on larger scale incidents. I am sorry for venting here I am sure I am preaching to the choir.

My only question is why would an ems rig be less of a problem for a young driver. Honestly the bus seems to afford more resposibilty of the driver and need more seasond jugment to handle the whole picture. By no means am I saying fire trucks can be driven by anyone just the bus adds a patient to the mix. Along with the crew and the public. 21 years of age min. And 4 years min driving experince seems good start for either side. Along with the department having a good driver training program.

Dover has an AED on everything and a full EMS jump bag on the brush truck and the engine that has extrication tools on it. I agree with this topic 100% departments should have an AED on every rig for the simple fact you never know weather your out on a run and one of our own goes down. You could be doing a local bit for the community or schools and any one could go down. I also agree at the very least every firefighter should have CPR as a required class.

I do not know when every departments starts the new year for new officers. So I just want to extend my congrats and say good luck to all new and old officers starting the new year.

Hey your right we don't have the whole story but one thing you can see clear is he is taking his sweet ..... well time to move out of the way which I understand the conditions must have been bad but come on a little git up in your go wouldn't hurt.

I don't know what to say but wow hope the bus driver gets a pink slip for the new year.

I tend to agree the first main blast was an O2 tank letting go but I would say at least one of the little pop offs was some kind of metal or something water reactive the way it was a white hot kind of sparking. I am just glad no one got hurt.

I am just gonna give a short and sweet reply to this. Agreed FD probably dose not have to go to all mva's but here is the deal obvious calls they are needed tools in operation fluids fire hazard ect. But they should there for any time people are working in the roadway a 20plus ton fire truck is a better spot for a stray car then the group of pd and ems.

That is so great when I get back to a computer I have to give u some rep points. That is the best quotes for pump ops ever.

Congrats to all

And good luck

Congratulations to all

Also a word of warning the more gadgets you add the more likely of a failure and out of service time diverters and other devices may cause more headaches.

I hope everyone specing a rig with regen makes sure the is an off switch at least in the cab maybe even on the rig some where else city buses do this. Also I don't know for certin but I am sure there is some sort of safty interlock that dose not alow the regen to happen in pump since the motor has to go though cycles of rpms and different loads. I know some trucks come with a manual switch so be proactive whent the light starts coming on take the 30mins and park it in you lot away from everything and run it.

As far as just operating pump/aerail at the same time mid or rear mout get a truck with pump panel mounted controls as well I know our quint has both pull one switch and u have all thye controll at the pump. Personal I think mid mout ladders are better suited for the majority of needs.

I might be way off but how would you justify that to the towns taxpayers that they need to pay taxes for a county team that should be able to be funded by the county taxes they pay.

I Still say pressure the politicians that take the money from where its supposed to be and use it not responsible.

The short answer it really depends on where you are for example fdny has fire marshals and do building inspections. I am not sure about all the paid depts. But I am pretty sure arlington and city of pok do inpections. But for the most part the towns have a building inspector that dose the job as far as I have seen for the code enforcment. Fire investigation was left up to the chief and the fid team was a reasource formed to aid in the chiefs responsibilty to find the origin and cause. No that's not even cut and dry across the county since I do not know if they still do but east fishkill had their own FID.

And I am pretty sure its Still not set in stone that they are out I don't think the budget is final.

We were not talking about the vollie team but all the jobs in the county emergence response. And no offence I understand it seems like 1k 2k is not that much but the way things are going departments are gonna have to realy crack down on spending. Even local goverments are making cuts so departments are gonna have to do more with what they have for a budget or mabye less of a budget.

Yes every part of the county support is important but for now until somthing is set in stone and really cut can we stray away from the budget issues that I am sure most really do not know because we are not in it.

Maybe stick to why the teams are important and info on investigating fites but leave out the mud until the real reasons come out.

What's their budget for the year cutting them might have not done anything to help the situation I agree I hear the fid called alot more but as crappy as it is politicians make about money and put those guys in a rough spot to make decisions they probably do not want to make.

We could go back and forth all day about different ways to cut back but the simple fact is we do not know the whole story on what there is to work with we should be pressuring the govt. To give more money to the emergency services so thease decisions would not have to be made.