velcroMedic1987

I would ask for clarification from your agency however if the vic is not moving they're already dead. This is an extremely effective method. FDNY EMS offers us the out of waiting for HazMat before even attempting to open the vehicle essentially assuring the patient is good and dead. If it were me and I saw motion from the victim I would don my APR or in your case SCBA, break the glass, and extricate the victim being careful not to spill the chemicals. The line would come in handy for immediate decon, but I wouldn't wait for it. H2S vapor is only a skin irritant.

Whoa, that's a big assumption. They might not be dead if the they didn't use H2S, didn't mix it properly, didn't have the right chemicals to start, didn't pass out from an unrelated drug overdose prior to mixing the chemicals, aren't too stupid to follow internet directions. Just because a note on the window says call haz-mat doesn't mean it was H2S.

Sure, it's an extremely effective method if you do it right. If they screw it up they may just be unconscious. I don't think we can just say "if they're not moving they're dead". We may have to await haz-mat or other resources but we shouldn't treat it like a DOA just because we think it may be a H2S suicide.

How'd they determine this guy was dead anyway?

This is a great topic and something I talk about all the time. As an EMT for 21 years, 9 of which as an EMT-I, I have seen such a decline in the quality of new EMTs. I am not sure if it is do to poor instruction, and people being "pushed through" the class, or it is Medic "dependency" (or a combination). I have always told my members that the best way to learn is by doing - the more calls you do, the better you will become. I have heard EMTs waiting on scene for the Medic to show-up - I always say, do what you have been taught and trained to do.

I admit, when the Medic system first came in to our Town, I had a difficult time with it. I went from running calls to driving the fly car. It was very frustrating to get up in the middle of the night, go to a call and either just stand there while the Medic "did his/her thing" and not say a word or give you any info, except for "can you find a garbage can for this stuff" and "who's driving my car". Things have improved greatly; I guess it just took time for them to realize the capabilities of the EMTs and for me to not be intimidated by them and be able to work with them.

Our Corps has abolished the CME program for recertification. We encourage people to take classes, attend lectures, get any further education you can. But when it comes to the basics, everyone should go through the skills and sit for the exam. If you can't do that, then you have no business being an EMT.

I've been in the same boat and had many of the same problems. Because EMS is so poorly regulated and managed from the State right down to the agency this is not going to go away.

Glad you stuck it out and didn't go the way of so many EMT's and just quit.

If I knew I wouldn't get in trouble I would stomp on those stupid clip boards!

And the person holding the clipboard is always wearing gloves too!

Date: 03-22-11

Time: 1955

Location: Yonkers City Pier on Main Street

Frequency: YPD F1, YFD, Empress EMS

Units Operating: YPD 4th Pct, ESU Trucks 2 and 4, 410, 900, YFD, Empress EMS

Weather Conditions: cloudy, cold

Description Of Incident: Person fell into the water from the pier and can not get back up. Hanging on to object in water.

YPD ESU reports victim is out of the water and being transported to St. Joseph's by Empress.

Reporters/Writer:: VelcroMedic1987

Hey everyone,

I received a reply from the author of the JEMS article....it is as follows:

When I was full time FD we were three paramedics to a truck and it wasn't unusual to drop one of us with a jump kit at one scene while the truck continued to the next; we knew there were transport units enroute and sometimes there were also volunteers.

Imagine that! Knowing you have transport units coming and having three paramedics on an ALS unit. Sounds like a real system.

Nurses should have their own case audits to have their performance assessed and improved upon just like medics. Nurses don't have the licenses paramedics operate under so it really doesn't matter to me if they're at the audits or not.

What I want is more MD involvement and interaction. The system sucks because I can go to audits whereever I want and never have one of my calls reveiewed. Or I go to an audit and have another paramedic reviewing the calls. This does nothing for me.

The whole reason for call audits was supposedly quality improvement. We still don't have response time standards or guarantees that the services we have can get their buses on the road. But we can't have any new agencies working in the areas because of CON requirements.

Emergency services in NY are all messed up. Reading the threads here only highlights the bigger problems.

180 fire departments at 1.5 million dollars a year is 270 MILLION or over a quarter BILLION dollars a year.

You could have ten departments at half the cost.

If my taxes for just the fd were as high as some on long island I'd refuse to pay. It is out of control.

Did you see the vehicle pulling the light tower:

http://www.facebook.com/NYRRT?sk=info#!/photo.php?fbid=51065033780&set=pu.41565548780&theater

Is that a Photoshop job? That truck appears to have both the FDNY logo and NYRRT logo on it.

That is bogus.

Date: 03-19-11

Time: 0145

Location: Yonkers - Cross County Parkway - Webster Ave in New Rochelle

Frequency: multiple

Units Operating: Yonkers PD, County PD, New Rochelle PD

Weather Conditions: cloudy

Description Of Incident: shooting in Yonkers. YPD attempted to stop a vehicle that fled onto CCP. During the pursuit a gun was tossed from the vehicle. Pursued into New Rochelle where it was ultimately stopped and 5 were arrested. One suspect was tazed by NRPD. One officer injured.

Reporters:

Writer: VelcroMedic1987

Also during the pursuit a vehicle attempted to interfere with the pursuit. It was stopped and multiple arrests were made there also.

Multiple crime scenes and K9 article searches underway.

If you ask me it's just nuts. They have divers? For what? Who's going to take the risk of using them?

Are they even governed by the same laws that protect us during mutual aid responses? If not, they better have really big insurance policies.

There are some really good volunteer search and rescue associations but these guys seem to be trying to branch out into everything.

Whats with the pictures of them with stretchers? Do they have ambulances too? Come on.

My old VFD used to designate past chiefs as "deputy chiefs". They still ran with lights and sirens on their POVs and could be used as a line officer if none were present.

Date: 03-18-11

Time: 2000

Location: 505 North State Road

Frequency: WCPD, Briarcliff PD

Units Operating: Westchester County PD (Ossining Town patrols plus), Aviation, K-9, additional units from WCPD road patrol, Briarcliff Manor PD

Weather Conditions: clear

Description Of Incident: Commercial burglary interrupted, two suspects fled on foot into wooded area behind business. Aviation and K-9 requested. Ground units establishing perimeter.

Reporters:

Writer: VelcroMedic1987

2105 - Suspect apprehended in woods behind 50 Burns Lane. Only one suspect, all units clearing. Suspect transported to WCPD for processing.

Date: 03-18-11

Time: 1820

Location: 28 Lamartine Terrace

Frequency: YPD 2

Units Operating: YPD ESU Trucks 2 and 4, K9-5, 410, 4th Pct Patrol Units, Empress EMS, Westchester County PD Aviation

Weather Conditions: clear

Description Of Incident: Report of subject on fire escape 4th floor, unknown how he got there. Additional subject is on PCP. ESU made contact with subject from roof and contained him. Additional ESU forced entry to apartment to access subject to avoid long trip on fire escape.

Reporters:

Writer: VelcroMedic1987

Date: 03-18-11

Time: 1630 approx

Location: IFO 36 Dekalb Avenue

Frequency: WPPD 1

Units Operating: WPPD Patrol, DD, ESU, TransCare EMS, MTA PD K9

Weather Conditions: clear

Description Of Incident: Person shot, unknown condition, transported to WPH. At least two suspects in custody, perp search for additional. MTA K9 requested for article search.

Reporters:

Writer: VelcroMedic1987

Date: 02-23-11

Time: 1430

Location: Cross County Parkway x New Rochelle Road

Frequency: radios/hotlines

Units Operating: Mt Vernon PD, County PD, New Rochelle PD, Eastchester PD, Tuckahoe PD, Bronxville PD, others

Weather Conditions: clear

Description Of Incident: One suspect fled on foot from traffic stop, second suspect in custody at vehicle, foot pursuit and perp search involving numerous agencies, K-9's, aviation, ESU

Reporters: velcromedic1987

Writer: velcromedic1987

The county and other places has spent oodles of grant money on equipment and toys and big vehicles that they can't staff.

And because they cant staff them they dont like to talk about them. Youd think theyd be out there parading these resources around but because they have no plan to staff them and deploy them when they're needed its embarrassing to them.

And because the four cities that account for most of the population dont need a lot of help and try to hold the county accountable, the County doesnt want to get caught claiming to have resources that it doesnt really have when one of the cities needs them.

And as a political appointee the boss there has to tread lightly or face the unemployment line.

Try calling your legislator and ask them what these trailers can do. DES has to answer to them.

Once again its individual Police Officers that are doing this, let us not lump everyone together! I say block all you need, going off face value of the article I'd say at least one lane other than the center should have been blocked. And, if need be, block it all while the patient is taken out of the car and put into the ambulance, how long could it take? 5 minutes? How about 5 hrs for an AI when someone gets hit!

Good point. Don't throw out all the apples just because of one bad one in the barrel.

Cogs,

All legalities aside, don't you think that if the volunteer departments (aside from yours of course) would truly admit that they are not providing the best fire protection for their residents and admitted that they needed help, regardless of what the charter says, this could be done? If nobody files a law suit saying that the city violated our charter, then there would be no battle. It would only be about what is best for fire protection. The mayor himself admitted that one of the main reasons that SFRD is not combining with the volunteer departments is the threat of law suits from the volunteers. It makes it very hard to believe that the citizens safety is their first priority.

They'll never admit that they can't do it and they'll continue to threaten the politicians as a big block of voters.

If the politicians are refusing to take action on the threat of lawsuits, they're cowards and incompetent. Lawsuits get threatened every day and if the city is right the city will win. If the city's goal is to save money and improve fire resposne and accountability of the departments, they would have a very strong case. What's the volunteers lawyer going to do in court when he can't prove being able to meet NFPA 1920 for a minimum response or produce all the required records and documentation of training, etc.?

Unless the volunteers in an integrated system rostered in house and responded with the SFRD, it will be a tiered response.

Stop spouting off about how the volunteers save money because if they can't put a fire out they're not saving anyone anything.

As long as nobody is holding anyone accountable and demanding action, this is going to continue endlessly and sooner or later someone is going to die while everyone protects their turf.

So by the time I got to work the were calling for 2 to 5" for the 5 boroughs. We were all issued skeds for equipment and patient transport over long distances. Two different chiefs visited the station to check salt, vehicles, snow blowers, toy shovels, and canvas members for overnight availability tomorrow. Panic mode is rocking! 6" on the ground with a blizzard warning and we had to unwrap a snow blower that had been delivered for a station that still hasn't been built. Predicting a maximum of less than 6" and everyone is in a tizzy.

Typical. Knee jerk reaction by them to show how much they're doing even though one storm was a bilzzard and this one is barely shovel-able.

What about an under appreciated, under paid and compensated, paramedic that needs to work 3 jobs to survive?

Time to consider a new profession if you're that under everything.

So you're saying that with one full box out that your company is the second due to areas that are 10 minutes away? That sounds pretty good to me.

Pretty good on what planet? You may think a 10 minute response time is good but I don't. Not unlike most taxpayers I expect you there right after I hang up the phone (sarcasm). 10 minutes is not a good response time.

Seriously? At least you can come up with a better argument. I guess we should just build an engine and truck company onto every house that is built.

Relevance = 0.

If there's a firehouse that is closed because the city thinks it can play russian roulette with my life and my neighbors lives you're damn right that's a good argument. The FD isn't arguing to put a firehouse on every corner, they're just saying keep the ones they've got and keep them properly staffed.

Thanks for the intelligent reply. It's much better to see that some actually can think rather than put out the old argument of "what if your family lives next to a fire house that's closed?"

You are right that "call volume" isn't the best way to allocate staffing. However, I'm fairly certain that the FDNY would track things such as personnel used and manhours per incident. That, along with response time and a few other factors can lead to a better analysis of the system's needs. As far as knowing "when and where" your calls are going to be, you obviously cannot plan the exact time and location but you can very easily model trends, especially in an area with as high a volume as NYC. That's the principle behind system status management, generally predicting the area of the next call and positioning resources to handle that call.

One of the previous posters said that his company is second due for a structure fire that is 10 minutes away if a first structure fire is already going. My next question to that would be how often does this happen. If it happens once a year, then it may not pay to add resources. If it happens once a week, then staffing might have to be increased. This is all learned through proper analysis of the system, something which nobody appears willing to do. The government just wants to cut; the Union just wants to save jobs ... neither is a productive view.

FDNY routinely has to relocate companies from one COUNTY to another COUNTY (boroughs). They also have to reduce the response for some alarms because of the reduce availability. This all translates into greater exposure and in a business model exposure = liablity = a bad idea. Yet the city continues to gamble with our lives.

Relevance = 0.

Thank you for the intelligent response. NOT.

I wasn't equating "like a business" to "profitable". What I meant by more like a business is that they need to constantly analyze needs and to correlate expenditures to those needs. It makes no sense to keep a firehouse open at night because its needed during the day. It does make sense to keep that firehouse open at night if there is a proven need for it. I find it extremely hard to believe that FDNY needs the same amount of resources at 0300 than it does at 1500.

Just an educated guess, the population shifts from the outerboroughs to Manhattan during the day and the opposite at night. Others have already told you about the bars, clubs, theaters, service industry, restaurants, etc. that keep a very high population even at night. While the location of the population density may shift a little bit, 8 million is still a stupid-high number of people.

I find it hard to believe that you're arguing about this issue.

I don't know what website you got that from. We don't do EMS.

Relevance = 0

I think we did just over 200 (no EMS).

Wow, where do you find the time to post here with that kind of work? You must be exhausted. One call every other day and you're telling guys that do 68 fires a day how they should be staffed? Come on now.

So now you're saying that the NATIONAL STANDARD of 8 minutes for full response to an alarm is pathetically long? If I had the full first alarm assignment at my house within 8 minutes with another fire going on in my district, I'd be jumping for joy.

Eight minutes is a very long time, especially if your house is on fire. Yes it may be the national standard but nothing says you shouldn't strive for better. FDNY has a remarkable response time given the city demographics and they shouldn't be screwing with it before cutting the number of times ball fields get mowed or tennis courts get built. Life safety is expensive and you shouldn't screw with it.

I've agreed with you on many points in the past but I think you're way off base in this thread. Time to move on.

Adam Stiebeling, deputy commissioner of Emergency Services for Putnam County, said any person interested in volunteering should visit their local firehouse and ask about joining. Some departments accept new members at certain times of the year, others have open enrollment.

A spokeswoman for Rockland County Fire and Emergency Services said prospective volunteers in Rockland should also visit their local firehouse.

Great advice. Send people to the empty firehouses to sign-up. That'll motivate em. Smooth move.

You can't compare a volunteer agency to a paid one, let alone the biggest and up to this point best manned one in the Country. If you were to send R3 to this job did anyone notify R1 and R2 of this so that they could be repositioned if needed? I don't know why R3 was sent to a box in queens to begin with, why not utilize the SSL's that is what they are for. Now that every Rescue has a collapse unit, the days of R3 going out the door for every ceiling collapse from a water leak are over, luckily for them. The whole issue with volunteers is everyone is always who is stepping on the other, not who is going to benefit from this. The issue of pride always gets in the way, and that hurts the people that need the help. When you look at some places getting dispatched 2 or 3 times for a daytime alarm why not just call the neighboring dept as well.

Pay attention, sport. They're not comparing FDNY to volunteer FD's. They're discussing communications and they aren't volunteer agencies.

Your pride is really getting in the way of this thread cause your response has nothing at all to do with the topic. You don't have to know what R3 was sent to a box in QN. The dispatchers acting on the best information at the time believed it was warranted. Jeez.

Date: 12-17-10

Time: 1800

Location: 2195 Central Park Avenue - Chase Bank

Frequency: Yonkers PD

Units Operating: Yonkers PD 1st Pct, DD, CIU, WCPD Aviation

Weather Conditions: clear

Description Of Incident: Bank robbery - three armed suspects robbed bank and fled with approximately $410,000. This was the second robbery of a Chase bank today. Unkown ATT if related.

Reporters: velcro

Writer:

http://www.lohud.com/article/20101217/NEWS02/12170381/Yonkers-police--3-armed-bandits-steal--410-000-from-bank

Congrats and good luck!!!

I hope you live a long healthy life and put a big dent in the NYSPFRS!