PEMO3

1) There are plenty of VAC's right here in Westchester that are dying for volunteers.
2) While you say "add", if this were to work, Quin and other politicians will cut the jobs, becuase you are saving them $$$ by volunteering. Since they already determined that they believe in the cuts they have already made. This will net you no additional units and when the volunteers get tired of playing 2nd string, you will actually have a loss.

To answer your question. They don't transport the clinic appointment. The people know how to work the system. They call for a "emergency" e.g. stomach pain, nausea x 2 days, asthma, etc. They know what gets a waiting room seat and what gets inside. They get put in the waiting room, leave and go upstairs to their clinic appointment. They also know if they have public insurance (medicaid) they get a bus token or cab fare home from the social worker. Just because insurance states it pays for an ambulance does not make that ambulance ride medically necessary. I can't tell you how many times I got stuck with these "taxi rides" only to hear a true emergency like a cardiac arrest or a pedestrian struck drop and the closest unit was coming from a distance and it was our area. Just because books or studies say it is the solution does not mean it is. The people in the trenches will give you the solution before some study by a focus group. I hope that helps to give you a clearer picture of the problem-not a lack of resources but an abuse of the system.

To answer your question. They don't transport the clinic appointment. The people know how to work the system. They call for a "emergency" e.g. stomach pain, nausea x 2 days, asthma, etc. They know what gets a waiting room seat and what gets inside. They get put in the waiting room, leave and go upstairs to their clinic appointment. They also know if they have public insurance (medicaid) they get a bus token or cab fare home from the social worker. Just because insurance states it pays for an ambulance does not make that ambulance ride medically necessary. I can't tell you how many times I got stuck with these "taxi rides" only to hear a true emergency like a cardiac arrest or a pedestrian struck drop and the closest unit was coming from a distance and it was our area. Just because books or studies say it is the solution does not mean it is. The people in the trenches will give you the solution before some study by a focus group. I hope that helps to give you a clearer picture of the problem-not a lack of resources but an abuse of the system.

First calling FDNY a zoo is derogatory and unprofessional. Second, listening to a scanner does not make you an authority on the subject. Yes the cut finger could be from a rusty nail but lack of cab fare does not make it a 911 EMS call. If you believe it does then you should seek out a refresher course fast. It is this thinking that is overtaxing a system. You would be surprise how many of the I don't have cab fare public take an ambulance to the ER for a clinic appointment and leave the ER as soon as they are handed over and put in the waiting room and go upstairs for their appointment.It is obvious that we disagree and that is fine. You may want to check if Quinn needs a running mate.

To answer you question- Alot is wrong with this idea. FDNY EMS has a standard.of care. You can not water it down with EMT's that want experience but not the training. Second a low priority call can escalate to a "high priority " call easily leaving these inexperienced EMTs with their hands full and the patient short changed. Additionally how would you feel if your boss told you they were replacing your O/T slot with an unpaid, less experienced EMT but he will wear the same uniform as you. Lastly is accountability let alone FDNY EMS is a closed civil service union shop. You don't fix a problem with a leaky bandaid. But let's not overlook the fact that the only problem here was a politician in an election year.

30 minutes for a Priority 5 call as it was first triaged with no available buses in the system and calls waiting is not long. The heat wave is taxing the system. Quinn states that there should be more units out there to handle the call volume and that the system was not prepared. This is the same woman that voted to cut the FDNY & EMS budget and reduce the unit count. I guess it was just lip service until those cuts hit home. They also could have picked this young lady up and put her in the air conditioned SUV that she had waiting and I am sure running to ensure it was kept cool instead of "dragging" her under a tent to keep her cool.

"Quinn was speaking before cameras about the reopening of the controversial E. 91st St. marine transfer station when the 17-year-old girl suddenly dropped to the ground in front of the crowd shortly before noon, witnesses said.
The speaker ran over to the teen, who may have collapsed because of the heat, and began rubbing her arms as a member of Quinn's detail — an NYPD cop who is a trained EMT — began rendering aid to the girl.
"It's going to be okay," Quinn told the girl as another bystander called 911.
They quickly pulled the girl into the shade under a tent as Quinn's security guard grabbed an oxygen tank to help the young woman breathe.
But Quinn finally lost her patience after waiting about 30 minutes for an ambulance to arrive and dialed NYPD Commissioner Raymond Kelly for help.
"We were trying to get through to [FDNY Commissioner] Sal Cassano, and I was unable to get connected," Quinn said."
http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/dailypolitics/2013/07/chris-quinn-slams-outrageous-30-minute-wait-for-ambulance-after-intern-collaps
Interesting, injured woman faints and is conscious and being treat by "trained personnel" (a police officer who is also an EMT). Triaged as it should and held for higher priority calls due to a 25% spike in call volume. But because it is the Speakers intern there is "outrage " because it should have been a "priority 1" call. Maybe they should hold the arrest, MI, stroke or true unconscious for her intern. This is the same Speaker that would have called for a City Council investigation if an MOS family's call was bumped up. I guess it is justified when you call the Police Commissioners private cell and pull strings to get your low priority call bumped up to a high priority "unconscious" even though the woman was conscious. Maybe the speaker and her intern should have followed her own instructions that she has been handing out since the heat wave started - stay hydrated, in the shade when possible and wear light colored, loose fitting clothing.

There is a lot wrong with what you said. First lets make it clear that I don't want this to go down the paid vs volly road.
You are correct. EMTs fresh out of school spent 17 weeks training, but they did not spend 9 weeks, 40 hours per week training. Big difference. Second, FDNY EMS EMTs go through an extensive process before they ever step out on the street including a complete refresher regardless of when you got your card to ensure quality control. You are correct we are not looking for ER docs. Nothing against ER docs but most can not perform in the streets and conditions FDNY EMS works in.
You stated in your first post "The only difference would be in the training because you wont go through the FDNY*EMS academy but a shorter modified training program but you'll wear the same uniform and you will not get paid." Now you state "Train them to you standard because they already spent 17 weeks learning how to save lifes and at least 36 hours on the road." Which is it shorter, corners cut training or the full academy you can't have it both ways.
You have a brass pair calling it about "lining pockets" and stating "ambulance crews are sleeping off somewhere and had to get called multiple times before a response". If you want to get experience there are plenty of volunteer corps in NYC that will let you "get your feet wet". But to put it on the backs of the public by stating to solution is to bring in volunteers with less training standards is short sighted. Think about it, if you have the choice between a fully trained FDNY EMS crew or a wet behind the ears crew that is volunteering for experience, who would you want, honestly. If you choose the later then you are not honest.
The solution is public education about what is a 911 EMS call and letting the ER docs go back to signing the back of the call reports when it is not medically necessary so that Medicare & insurance pass the bill to the patients. Once they realize that the taxi with lights and sirens is about $400 more than the livery they will think twice about calling. It helped in the 90's.

This would just be used as another cost savings tool to cut down the number of staffed units.

To answer you question- Alot is wrong with this idea. FDNY EMS has a standard.of care. You can not water it down with EMT's that want experience but not the training. Second a low priority call can escalate to a "high priority " call easily leaving these inexperienced EMTs with their hands full and the patient short changed. Additionally how would you feel if your boss told you they were replacing your O/T slot with an unpaid, less experienced EMT but he will wear the same uniform as you. Lastly is accountability let alone FDNY EMS is a closed civil service union shop. You don't fix a problem with a leaky bandaid. But let's not overlook the fact that the only problem here was a politician in an election year.

Facts are simple. Most of the low priority calls are simply "taxi" runs. Some are actually for late clinic appointments, ER follow ups , etc. These people would complain if the unit arrived in 10 minutes. There are the exceptions that actually do require an ambulance either due to secondary conditions or incorrect information relayed during EMD. In a perfect world extra units could be added during extreme weather but unfortunately this politician is part of the same group that imposed budget restraints on agencies and the media is the same one that will list all of the "high overtime earners" names and address because they increased their base income to add these extra units. The politicians want it both ways. The simple solution is that these politicians should have held their press conference in a less environmentally hostile environment, ensure that their staff was safe and not created the problem in the first place.

Just a few clearifying facts. A post fainting heat related syncope us not a high priority. Also, regardless of Queen Quinn's statement the woman was immediately treated by a NYS EMT who happened to be her NYPD PO driver. The failure here is her failure to take a step back, distance herself from the incident, look at the big picture and find a solution without negatively impacting other NYC resident. The solution a SUV with official plates and ice cold a/c. First rule in heat rrelated injuries is to remove the patient from the hostile environment. The already cooled SUV could have surficed and also doubled as a transport option to an ER.

30 minutes for a Priority 5 call as it was first triaged with no available buses in the system and calls waiting is not long. The heat wave is taxing the system. Quinn states that there should be more units out there to handle the call volume and that the system was not prepared. This is the same woman that voted to cut the FDNY & EMS budget and reduce the unit count. I guess it was just lip service until those cuts hit home. They also could have picked this young lady up and put her in the air conditioned SUV that she had waiting and I am sure running to ensure it was kept cool instead of "dragging" her under a tent to keep her cool.

"Quinn was speaking before cameras about the reopening of the controversial E. 91st St. marine transfer station when the 17-year-old girl suddenly dropped to the ground in front of the crowd shortly before noon, witnesses said.
The speaker ran over to the teen, who may have collapsed because of the heat, and began rubbing her arms as a member of Quinn's detail — an NYPD cop who is a trained EMT — began rendering aid to the girl.
"It's going to be okay," Quinn told the girl as another bystander called 911.
They quickly pulled the girl into the shade under a tent as Quinn's security guard grabbed an oxygen tank to help the young woman breathe.
But Quinn finally lost her patience after waiting about 30 minutes for an ambulance to arrive and dialed NYPD Commissioner Raymond Kelly for help.
"We were trying to get through to [FDNY Commissioner] Sal Cassano, and I was unable to get connected," Quinn said."
http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/dailypolitics/2013/07/chris-quinn-slams-outrageous-30-minute-wait-for-ambulance-after-intern-collaps
Interesting, injured woman faints and is conscious and being treat by "trained personnel" (a police officer who is also an EMT). Triaged as it should and held for higher priority calls due to a 25% spike in call volume. But because it is the Speakers intern there is "outrage " because it should have been a "priority 1" call. Maybe they should hold the arrest, MI, stroke or true unconscious for her intern. This is the same Speaker that would have called for a City Council investigation if an MOS family's call was bumped up. I guess it is justified when you call the Police Commissioners private cell and pull strings to get your low priority call bumped up to a high priority "unconscious" even though the woman was conscious. Maybe the speaker and her intern should have followed her own instructions that she has been handing out since the heat wave started - stay hydrated, in the shade when possible and wear light colored, loose fitting clothing.

30 minutes for a Priority 5 call as it was first triaged with no available buses in the system and calls waiting is not long. The heat wave is taxing the system. Quinn states that there should be more units out there to handle the call volume and that the system was not prepared. This is the same woman that voted to cut the FDNY & EMS budget and reduce the unit count. I guess it was just lip service until those cuts hit home. They also could have picked this young lady up and put her in the air conditioned SUV that she had waiting and I am sure running to ensure it was kept cool instead of "dragging" her under a tent to keep her cool.

"Quinn was speaking before cameras about the reopening of the controversial E. 91st St. marine transfer station when the 17-year-old girl suddenly dropped to the ground in front of the crowd shortly before noon, witnesses said.
The speaker ran over to the teen, who may have collapsed because of the heat, and began rubbing her arms as a member of Quinn's detail — an NYPD cop who is a trained EMT — began rendering aid to the girl.
"It's going to be okay," Quinn told the girl as another bystander called 911.
They quickly pulled the girl into the shade under a tent as Quinn's security guard grabbed an oxygen tank to help the young woman breathe.
But Quinn finally lost her patience after waiting about 30 minutes for an ambulance to arrive and dialed NYPD Commissioner Raymond Kelly for help.
"We were trying to get through to [FDNY Commissioner] Sal Cassano, and I was unable to get connected," Quinn said."
http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/dailypolitics/2013/07/chris-quinn-slams-outrageous-30-minute-wait-for-ambulance-after-intern-collaps
Interesting, injured woman faints and is conscious and being treat by "trained personnel" (a police officer who is also an EMT). Triaged as it should and held for higher priority calls due to a 25% spike in call volume. But because it is the Speakers intern there is "outrage " because it should have been a "priority 1" call. Maybe they should hold the arrest, MI, stroke or true unconscious for her intern. This is the same Speaker that would have called for a City Council investigation if an MOS family's call was bumped up. I guess it is justified when you call the Police Commissioners private cell and pull strings to get your low priority call bumped up to a high priority "unconscious" even though the woman was conscious. Maybe the speaker and her intern should have followed her own instructions that she has been handing out since the heat wave started - stay hydrated, in the shade when possible and wear light colored, loose fitting clothing.

Facts are simple. Most of the low priority calls are simply "taxi" runs. Some are actually for late clinic appointments, ER follow ups , etc. These people would complain if the unit arrived in 10 minutes. There are the exceptions that actually do require an ambulance either due to secondary conditions or incorrect information relayed during EMD. In a perfect world extra units could be added during extreme weather but unfortunately this politician is part of the same group that imposed budget restraints on agencies and the media is the same one that will list all of the "high overtime earners" names and address because they increased their base income to add these extra units. The politicians want it both ways. The simple solution is that these politicians should have held their press conference in a less environmentally hostile environment, ensure that their staff was safe and not created the problem in the first place.

Just a few clearifying facts. A post fainting heat related syncope us not a high priority. Also, regardless of Queen Quinn's statement the woman was immediately treated by a NYS EMT who happened to be her NYPD PO driver. The failure here is her failure to take a step back, distance herself from the incident, look at the big picture and find a solution without negatively impacting other NYC resident. The solution a SUV with official plates and ice cold a/c. First rule in heat rrelated injuries is to remove the patient from the hostile environment. The already cooled SUV could have surficed and also doubled as a transport option to an ER.

30 minutes for a Priority 5 call as it was first triaged with no available buses in the system and calls waiting is not long. The heat wave is taxing the system. Quinn states that there should be more units out there to handle the call volume and that the system was not prepared. This is the same woman that voted to cut the FDNY & EMS budget and reduce the unit count. I guess it was just lip service until those cuts hit home. They also could have picked this young lady up and put her in the air conditioned SUV that she had waiting and I am sure running to ensure it was kept cool instead of "dragging" her under a tent to keep her cool.

"Quinn was speaking before cameras about the reopening of the controversial E. 91st St. marine transfer station when the 17-year-old girl suddenly dropped to the ground in front of the crowd shortly before noon, witnesses said.
The speaker ran over to the teen, who may have collapsed because of the heat, and began rubbing her arms as a member of Quinn's detail — an NYPD cop who is a trained EMT — began rendering aid to the girl.
"It's going to be okay," Quinn told the girl as another bystander called 911.
They quickly pulled the girl into the shade under a tent as Quinn's security guard grabbed an oxygen tank to help the young woman breathe.
But Quinn finally lost her patience after waiting about 30 minutes for an ambulance to arrive and dialed NYPD Commissioner Raymond Kelly for help.
"We were trying to get through to [FDNY Commissioner] Sal Cassano, and I was unable to get connected," Quinn said."
http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/dailypolitics/2013/07/chris-quinn-slams-outrageous-30-minute-wait-for-ambulance-after-intern-collaps
Interesting, injured woman faints and is conscious and being treat by "trained personnel" (a police officer who is also an EMT). Triaged as it should and held for higher priority calls due to a 25% spike in call volume. But because it is the Speakers intern there is "outrage " because it should have been a "priority 1" call. Maybe they should hold the arrest, MI, stroke or true unconscious for her intern. This is the same Speaker that would have called for a City Council investigation if an MOS family's call was bumped up. I guess it is justified when you call the Police Commissioners private cell and pull strings to get your low priority call bumped up to a high priority "unconscious" even though the woman was conscious. Maybe the speaker and her intern should have followed her own instructions that she has been handing out since the heat wave started - stay hydrated, in the shade when possible and wear light colored, loose fitting clothing.

The NYC Sergeants Benevolent Association representing the NYPD Sergeants is calling out Quinn for using special courtesies that have gotten others arrested, and for wasting money with her ridiculous Inspector General for the NYPD
http://sbanyc.net/documents/quinnAd.pdf

"Quinn was speaking before cameras about the reopening of the controversial E. 91st St. marine transfer station when the 17-year-old girl suddenly dropped to the ground in front of the crowd shortly before noon, witnesses said.
The speaker ran over to the teen, who may have collapsed because of the heat, and began rubbing her arms as a member of Quinn's detail — an NYPD cop who is a trained EMT — began rendering aid to the girl.
"It's going to be okay," Quinn told the girl as another bystander called 911.
They quickly pulled the girl into the shade under a tent as Quinn's security guard grabbed an oxygen tank to help the young woman breathe.
But Quinn finally lost her patience after waiting about 30 minutes for an ambulance to arrive and dialed NYPD Commissioner Raymond Kelly for help.
"We were trying to get through to [FDNY Commissioner] Sal Cassano, and I was unable to get connected," Quinn said."
http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/dailypolitics/2013/07/chris-quinn-slams-outrageous-30-minute-wait-for-ambulance-after-intern-collaps
Interesting, injured woman faints and is conscious and being treat by "trained personnel" (a police officer who is also an EMT). Triaged as it should and held for higher priority calls due to a 25% spike in call volume. But because it is the Speakers intern there is "outrage " because it should have been a "priority 1" call. Maybe they should hold the arrest, MI, stroke or true unconscious for her intern. This is the same Speaker that would have called for a City Council investigation if an MOS family's call was bumped up. I guess it is justified when you call the Police Commissioners private cell and pull strings to get your low priority call bumped up to a high priority "unconscious" even though the woman was conscious. Maybe the speaker and her intern should have followed her own instructions that she has been handing out since the heat wave started - stay hydrated, in the shade when possible and wear light colored, loose fitting clothing.

"Quinn was speaking before cameras about the reopening of the controversial E. 91st St. marine transfer station when the 17-year-old girl suddenly dropped to the ground in front of the crowd shortly before noon, witnesses said.
The speaker ran over to the teen, who may have collapsed because of the heat, and began rubbing her arms as a member of Quinn's detail — an NYPD cop who is a trained EMT — began rendering aid to the girl.
"It's going to be okay," Quinn told the girl as another bystander called 911.
They quickly pulled the girl into the shade under a tent as Quinn's security guard grabbed an oxygen tank to help the young woman breathe.
But Quinn finally lost her patience after waiting about 30 minutes for an ambulance to arrive and dialed NYPD Commissioner Raymond Kelly for help.
"We were trying to get through to [FDNY Commissioner] Sal Cassano, and I was unable to get connected," Quinn said."
http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/dailypolitics/2013/07/chris-quinn-slams-outrageous-30-minute-wait-for-ambulance-after-intern-collaps
Interesting, injured woman faints and is conscious and being treat by "trained personnel" (a police officer who is also an EMT). Triaged as it should and held for higher priority calls due to a 25% spike in call volume. But because it is the Speakers intern there is "outrage " because it should have been a "priority 1" call. Maybe they should hold the arrest, MI, stroke or true unconscious for her intern. This is the same Speaker that would have called for a City Council investigation if an MOS family's call was bumped up. I guess it is justified when you call the Police Commissioners private cell and pull strings to get your low priority call bumped up to a high priority "unconscious" even though the woman was conscious. Maybe the speaker and her intern should have followed her own instructions that she has been handing out since the heat wave started - stay hydrated, in the shade when possible and wear light colored, loose fitting clothing.

"Quinn was speaking before cameras about the reopening of the controversial E. 91st St. marine transfer station when the 17-year-old girl suddenly dropped to the ground in front of the crowd shortly before noon, witnesses said.
The speaker ran over to the teen, who may have collapsed because of the heat, and began rubbing her arms as a member of Quinn's detail — an NYPD cop who is a trained EMT — began rendering aid to the girl.
"It's going to be okay," Quinn told the girl as another bystander called 911.
They quickly pulled the girl into the shade under a tent as Quinn's security guard grabbed an oxygen tank to help the young woman breathe.
But Quinn finally lost her patience after waiting about 30 minutes for an ambulance to arrive and dialed NYPD Commissioner Raymond Kelly for help.
"We were trying to get through to [FDNY Commissioner] Sal Cassano, and I was unable to get connected," Quinn said."
http://www.nydailynews.com/blogs/dailypolitics/2013/07/chris-quinn-slams-outrageous-30-minute-wait-for-ambulance-after-intern-collaps
Interesting, injured woman faints and is conscious and being treat by "trained personnel" (a police officer who is also an EMT). Triaged as it should and held for higher priority calls due to a 25% spike in call volume. But because it is the Speakers intern there is "outrage " because it should have been a "priority 1" call. Maybe they should hold the arrest, MI, stroke or true unconscious for her intern. This is the same Speaker that would have called for a City Council investigation if an MOS family's call was bumped up. I guess it is justified when you call the Police Commissioners private cell and pull strings to get your low priority call bumped up to a high priority "unconscious" even though the woman was conscious. Maybe the speaker and her intern should have followed her own instructions that she has been handing out since the heat wave started - stay hydrated, in the shade when possible and wear light colored, loose fitting clothing.

It's about time they gave them something better that hand me down ambulances. Lord knows they have enough money tied up in trailers and other equipment that never moves. Nice to see money spent on something that will get utilized. The big question is are they going to be pre-staged out in the county like the old trucks or sit at 60 control for someone to have to respond there and pick it up.