Pleasant Valley Ambulance Service

[Beekman 5]

May 23, 2008

Pleasant Valley cuts ambulance costs

By John Davis

Poughkeepsie Journal

PLEASANT VALLEY - By shopping around, the town has reduced its annual ambulance costs by nearly $59,000 a year.

Last year, Alamo EMS increased the monthly fee it was charging the town from $1,054 to $9,366 a month.

Link to article

Edited May 24, 2008 by xfirefighter484x
Cut out most of article due to potential copyright and foum rule violation

[Guest alsfirefighter]

It amazes me that the cost only dropped when it went out to bid and there were 4 other agencies ready to walk in.

The town now faces the challenge of providing a port for the Alamo ambulance when the colder months return. The former port in the town firehouse is occupied by a new fire truck.

The town supervisor is optimistic the fire commissioners can make room for the Alamo ambulance - to avoid the cost of the town having to lease or build a garage.

Hmmmm...where I have I heard this before?

[Goose 188]

It amazes me that the cost only dropped when it went out to bid and there were 4 other agencies ready to walk in.

Hmmmm...where I have I heard this before?

Politics, politics, politics...

[Danger 160]

The town supervisor is optimistic the fire commissioners can make room for the Alamo ambulance - to avoid the cost of the town having to lease or build a garage.

Hmmmm...where I have I heard this before?

The Beekman unit sitting at the town highway garage?

Edited May 23, 2008 by Danger

[NWFDMedic 58]

Well, this sure comes as a surprise to me. I thought that Alamo had spent the last year saying that they were going to be responsible in bidding instead of following the path of Sloper by underbidding contracts and losing money. Having a good idea of the call volume and billable recovery of the PV community, they can't possibly be making money or breaking even with that contract.

[ny10570 745]

So did the service change to accommodate this drop in price or were they just trying to milk the town for a few extra K

[Guest]

The Beekman unit sitting at the town highway garage?

The only good thing for PV is the bus has to sit at their firehouse. They will know its there, ready to go to a call. Where I am, they just had to be around in the town, Sometimes it took 15-20 min to get to the scene. Now, they are no longer in my town. Besides, I thought NDP is in Beekman and Pawling. Alamo lost them also. Besides, soon NDP and Alamo will become one company.

Edited May 24, 2008 by xfirefighter484x
Fixed Grammar, and added punctuation

[Goose 188]

the only good thing for PV. is the bus has to set at there firehouse they will know its there ready to go to a call were i am they just had to be around in the town sometimes it took 15-20 min to get to the scean now they are no more in my town also i thought NDP is in beekman and pawling alamo lost them also and soon NDP and alamo will become one comp.

English would be great because i did not understand one thing you were trying to say.

[bil14ga 1]

English would be great because i did not understand one thing you were trying to say.

I second that!!! What did he say????

[TAPSJ 30]

As Far As I Know Beekman 34-79, Pawling 54-79 And Pleasant Valley 56-79 Are All Alamo. I Believe Dover 36-79 Is NDP. Everywhere Is Covered By Either Alamo, Mobile Life, NDP, Or Town Of Wappingers.

Thomas

[xfirefighter484x 234]

As Far As I Know Beekman 34-79, Pawling 54-79 And Pleasant Valley 56-79 Are All Alamo. I Believe Dover 36-79 Is NDP. Everywhere Is Covered By Either Alamo, Mobile Life, NDP, Or Town Of Wappingers.

Thomas

Beekman 34-79 is NDP.

[Goose 188]

Alamo no longer provides EMS coverage to Pawling or Beekman - those unit designations are owned by the respective FDs

[TAPSJ 30]

Well 2 Out Of 4 Is Good, Isn't???, LOL. I Thought I Might Have Been Wrong, But Now I Know Thanks Guys.

Thomas

Edited May 24, 2008 by TAPSJ

[Guest Yankee medic]

Why doesn't pvfd hire some more people and run their own ambulance and not worry about bidding out for a private to come in. Wouldn't that save the tax payers of the Valley money? Arlington, Lagrange, Fairview do their own ems work with their own. Granted Fairview doesn't have their own medics. If I'm not mistaken they don't pay for the fly car to sit at Fairview. Does it still take care of all of Hyde Park still? (the fly car Imean) I will talk with Goerge on that one. All hires at PVFD have to be EMT's so why can't they run their own ambulance during the day???

[64FFMJK 21]

The only EMS contract that I have read about latly that was done properly was the Highland contrat. Why pay for someting or some one to sit around and sleep when most "dedicated" rigs have extremly low call volumes. Highland has a contract that states Moble Life I belive provides service has a time limit from time of dispatch to time on scene since this is what realy matters. one or two ALS units could cover Dover, Pawling, Union Vale, And Beekman combined how often are all these units out on calls at the same time?

Realistic estimate of round the clock of a dedicated ALS unit

Medic $20.00 / Hour = $480.00

EMT $11.50 / Hour = $276.00

$756.00 per day payroll for staff X 365 Days = $275,940.00 per year payroll for staff with out benifits

12 months per year = $22,995.00 per month

now how much is EMS worth to a comunity????

remember this is only an estimate and does not include vehicles, fuel, benifits, or insurance.

We all need and should demand round the clock ALS care no matter what fire district you live in.

[Medibart 55]

You can guesstimate a rough cost of $80 per hour for an ALS bus all inclusive. So for 60 hours per week of coverage that's about $250K per year. Based on the population of the town my guess would be about 600 calls per year, 480 transports, maybe 300 transports during those hours they are running, just a guess. About $300 per call for recovery, that's $90K. So that's $250K - $90 = $160K. About $13K per month. They are getting $4450 per month for a loss of $8550 per month or roughly $100K per year in losses. Just an educated guess, I could be wrong.

[Beekman 5]

PV has a pretty progressive Fire District. It actually saves money by contracting out to the commercial agencies.

Please remember that in NY, Fire Districts cannot bill the insurance companies, contracted companies can. Also would you really want your career guys leaving town on a P4 taxi ride? The P4 and nonsense calls are the norm, not the guy actually having a heart attack or a stroke.

As for Beekman, UV, Dover and Pawling, it was discussed for 2 years. When the bids came in, it was cheaper for the 4 towns to go it alone with multiple units. Makes no sense but the commercial agencies were the ones who submitted the bids. As for when are the units out at the same time? More than you would expect. The calls come in waves. Center for Rehab doesn't help things either.

As for the Clinton comment on Pojo- anybody know what that was about or was it just an ignorant comment?

[gamewell45 258]

The only EMS contract that I have read about latly that was done properly was the Highland contrat. Why pay for someting or some one to sit around and sleep when most "dedicated" rigs have extremly low call volumes. Highland has a contract that states Moble Life I belive provides service has a time limit from time of dispatch to time on scene since this is what realy matters. one or two ALS units could cover Dover, Pawling, Union Vale, And Beekman combined how often are all these units out on calls at the same time?

Realistic estimate of round the clock of a dedicated ALS unit

Medic $20.00 / Hour = $480.00

EMT $11.50 / Hour = $276.00

$756.00 per day payroll for staff X 365 Days = $275,940.00 per year payroll for staff with out benifits

12 months per year = $22,995.00 per month

now how much is EMS worth to a comunity????

remember this is only an estimate and does not include vehicles, fuel, benifits, or insurance.

We all need and should demand round the clock ALS care no matter what fire district you live in.

Also remember vacation relief staffing, replacement for sick, personal and brevement days, payroll tax, modification to the existing fire house if not already for career personel; and they also get yearly pay raises. Let the town deal with it instead of the fire district. Better to have the ambulance provider to deal with payroll, benefits and so forth.

Edited May 24, 2008 by gamewell45

[64FFMJK 21]

I talked with the owners of NDP when I was dispatching there and when added up a ALS unit dedicated 24 / 7 with all expenses included was roughly $750,000 per year and that is almost a year old figure. I do know that starting VERY soon the NDP and Alamo merger will be complete. I still d not see why there is a need for dedicated units Highlands contract is writen so that they agancy has 9 minutes from time of disptch to get on scene. then it is $100 / minute taken from what the agancy gets paid per month.

Then again with all of this said and having worked in commercial EMS for a few years I can say with out a doubt that ALS is overused if not blatantly ABUSED by both BLS vollie units that don't want to do a transport and by ER staff that want half their job done when the PT rolls in the door. I am not saying that there are too many ALS unts in an means there are far too few, I simply wonder why a ALS unit transports a BLS pcych PT when there are BLS units on the scene and so on.

[64FFMJK 21]

As for Beekman, UV, Dover and Pawling, it was discussed for 2 years. When the bids came in, it was cheaper for the 4 towns to go it alone with multiple units. Makes no sense but the commercial agencies were the ones who submitted the bids. As for when are the units out at the same time? More than you would expect. The calls come in waves.

Actuly I know very well I worked the Dover BLS unit for over 1 year. It was usualy the best 12 hours of sleep a day I have ever gotten. yes we did havebusy times I will give you that but I also rember all to well that most of all the calls wer usualy handeled by the ALS unit that was sleeping in the other part of the Dover Station.

I think that more Fire Districts need to look into staffing a BLS unit and get a ALS flycar based suport since this would grratly reduce costs in the first place or if they are going to contract out get over the fact you can't staff a BLS unit and sell the ambulance or allow a contracted staff to use the ambulance as part of the contract to offset the cost.

I knoe that there is no quick or easy answer to this problem and that any transition is going to be difficult at best. I have heard rumers that Fairview, Roosevelt, Hyde Park, And Staatsburg are looking to combine the EMS portion of their Districts snce all of these districts are have ing manpower issues for EMS calls and 2 of the 4 have done away with their ambulances.

Edited May 24, 2008 by 64FFMJK

[pfdfirefighter01 1]

from what i heard, as of july 1 alamo and NDp will be one company.

[NWFDMedic 58]

You can guesstimate a rough cost of $80 per hour for an ALS bus all inclusive. So for 60 hours per week of coverage that's about $250K per year. Based on the population of the town my guess would be about 600 calls per year, 480 transports, maybe 300 transports during those hours they are running, just a guess. About $300 per call for recovery, that's $90K. So that's $250K - $90 = $160K. About $13K per month. They are getting $4450 per month for a loss of $8550 per month or roughly $100K per year in losses. Just an educated guess, I could be wrong.

Hey Bart. I think you probably guestimated the recovery a bit on the low side with the population demographics of the town, but who's counting. I would also imagine that $80/hour cost could probably be bumped up a bit given the increased cost of fuel and equipment/products secondary to the increased cost of fuel. But the bottom line is quite correct; I can't see the contract being break even, much less being at least somewhat profitable.

[x134 46]

Why doesn't pvfd hire some more people and run their own ambulance and not worry about bidding out for a private to come in. Wouldn't that save the tax payers of the Valley money? Arlington, Lagrange, Fairview do their own ems work with their own. Granted Fairview doesn't have their own medics. If I'm not mistaken they don't pay for the fly car to sit at Fairview. Does it still take care of all of Hyde Park still? (the fly car Imean) I will talk with Goerge on that one. All hires at PVFD have to be EMT's so why can't they run their own ambulance during the day???

Because it was the fire districts decision to turn the ambulance coverage to the town.And the town contracted to Alamo. That was done before the Career guys started in the valley. Even if the valley hired more firefighters to run the ambulance they would still need a medic. The town likes having a full rig Medic and Emt.