Volunteer Chiefs Cars and Personal Use

[firecapt32 282]

I got a plane to catch in the morning so my advice is--there is a person at OFPC Mark Butler he does seminars on" legal issues in the fire service" call him get some stright answers to the question.

[FD36 4]

I don't know how long you've been in the fire service, but its constantly evolving; how'd we get along all those years w/o SCBA's or portable radios or cell phones or bunker pants and the list goes on and on. Could you imagine the chiefs in NYC being told to use their own cars and we'll pay for the lights and sirens and give you an allowance for gas?? I honestly don't thing it'd go over to well with them. If your doing work for any public agency where you need to be able to go out on the road on a moments notice you need to have the tools to do the job properly; and in many cases having a chiefs car is a "tool" that they need to have.

Correct that the fire service is constantly evolving, but sometimes it seems that every department in gods creation has at least three brand new suv's. Maybe its me but as a taxpayer I would rather see that money better spent, maybe on a more fuel efficient vehicle, or some new tools for firefighters. You take a look at some of the departments in lower westchester, the bigger cities, and they don't have the newest and greatest of vehicles or apparatus for that fact. IMO money could be spread a little farther by saving a buck here and there, starting with vehicles and fuel.

[INIT915 1,119]

Personally speaking, I only feel comfortable on commenting/criticizing the community in which I live. This is the community I pay taxes in. I don't see how I have any standing in critiquing other communities.

I don't live in (insert any Town, City, Village here), so what right do I have to complain about how they allocate their funding?

My question is, how many of the people on this thread have publicly voiced concerns? I don't mean here on Bravo, behind a screenname. Ever go to the City/Town/Village Board meeting and raise these issues?

If not, I feel it's a little hypocritical.

As an example, the Hastings Chief seems to have been a focus here. Has anyone been to a meeting of the Hastings Village Board and voiced their concerns? Commented to the Hastings Fire Commissioners? Taken any official action? And, if you don’t live in Hastings and pay Hastings taxes, I really don’t see the point. You can insert any locale in place of Hastings.

If you haven't, then, ...?

[Guest EFFP411]

Personally speaking, I only feel comfortable on commenting/criticizing the community in which I live. This is the community I pay taxes in. I don't see how I have any standing in critiquing other communities.

I don't live in (insert any Town, City, Village here), so what right do I have to complain about how they allocate their funding?

My question is, how many of the people on this thread have publicly voiced concerns? I don't mean here on Bravo, behind a screenname. Ever go to the City/Town/Village Board meeting and raise these issues?

If not, I feel it's a little hypocritical.

As an example, the Hastings Chief seems to have been a focus here. Has anyone been to a meeting of the Hastings Village Board and voiced their concerns? Commented to the Hastings Fire Commissioners? Taken any official action? And, if you don’t live in Hastings and pay Hastings taxes, I really don’t see the point. You can insert any locale in place of Hastings.

If you haven't, then, ...?

Good Point, Speak about that only which you know, if any person on this board really has a major issue with the way things are done in their town, i would think they wouldn't be complaining about it here, but rather attending town meetings, the fire district comissioner's meetings in THEIR town to bring up these issues. What honest good does posting it here do?? A whole lot of NOTHING... besides stir the pot IMHO

Edited April 26, 2009 by EFFP411

[RWC130 594]

INIT915,

Excellect Point!

[ladder55 26]

hey smoke why does this bother you so much? why is it even any of your business? like many have said... go to a board meeting and ask questions. maybe the mayor or trustees in his district told him its A OK to take the chiefs car to work. i dont know why your looking for answers here. maybe next time you pass the chiefs car you could ask him? or is that to tough?

[gamewell45 258]

Correct that the fire service is constantly evolving, but sometimes it seems that every department in gods creation has at least three brand new suv's. Maybe its me but as a taxpayer I would rather see that money better spent, maybe on a more fuel efficient vehicle, or some new tools for firefighters. You take a look at some of the departments in lower westchester, the bigger cities, and they don't have the newest and greatest of vehicles or apparatus for that fact. IMO money could be spread a little farther by saving a buck here and there, starting with vehicles and fuel.

While it may seem to you that "every department in gods creation has at least three brand new suv's" most departments that i'm familiar with normally keep their Chiefs cars, which may be SUV's or pick-up trucks and yes the occasional Crown Victoria for 4-5 years. As I said in a earlier thread if you have an issue with your districts policy regarding the purchase/use of chiefs cars, you should discuss it with the fire commissioners or Mayor; if its not in your district, its not your concern.

[Guest]

Why pay for CDL training when departments can pay for chiefs cars? Well, now that home rule applies to questions on EMTBravo, I guess this thread will die soon

[ec255 22]

Ok so my second question kinda got answered but not really. There are career departments that run 3000 to 4000 calls a year that update command cars less then the volunteer service. But even though the volunteer service does 1000 calls a year and most milege is put on for non department driving its a justified cost put off to the tax payer to replace a command car!

My first question is still out there! No one can justify this car or any car going to a personal job on the tax payer buck?

Next question

How many volunteer departments in Westchester have more then 1 Chief with a department car for personal use?

FYI due to the current economy people are losing jobs every day and the unemployment numbers are at there highest yet someone can use these cars to travel to work? Its not just the one I saw its all over in every city, town and village. Eliminating the uses can save dollars and help save jobs! I'm not saying eliminate the command car but don't drive it 20 miles away for your personal job!

So your suggestion would be to park the vehicle at the Fire station for the 8 or so hours that the Chief is at work? I speak for my own Department but we run a tight ship financially- we have one of the lowest budgets in Westchester- we don't pay salary, benefits and retirements to our members so that fuel usage to me is a cost of doing business- as long as it is not excessive distances travelled - i'm fine with it ( and I'm a taxpayer in the same town I volunteer- so it's MY tax money too)

[cman473 56]

you are a VOLUNTEER!!!

you are offering your time to help not for perks. Insurance companies should not cover YOUR car responding to a Emergency call. WHY? Your not driving an Emergency vehicle!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Your blue light does not count!

Can you tell me where in my post does it say anything about blue lights? I am talking about chiefs and there personal vehicles, I thought I was pretty clear but then again, that's what you get when you don't actually read the post!

And as for the attitude, not needed, your only proving how ignorant you really are.

[cman473 56]

Sour grapes?

No, No sour grapes here. I am privileged to have a chief's car. We have 3 of them, ALL of that which we have we bought were used. I drive a 99 Expedition and then we have 2 -03 Tahoes. I have heard of the insurance issue and seen some of the replies from the insurance companies.

I believe there are times to use the vehicle and times not to. Going on a quote job or to provide a service for your place of employment is one of those times someone should just leave the thing home.

I take mine to work, I respond to alarms from work and when my job requires me to go some where other than the office, I leave it home and take my vehicle. Its definatley not that difficult.

[hudson144 150]

Just a thought here- In 1946-1948 my grandfather was a Chief, he drove a 1940 Pontiac with one round red light on the bumper and a 6 volt siren.

In 1962-1964 my father was a chief, he drove a 1958 ford fairlane with a bubble gum light on the roof a siren and yes they had 1 radio (46.26), his own vehicle. No car seats for myself or my sisters either! lol

How times have changed!!!!

Edited April 26, 2009 by hudson144

[ja3kfd 34]

I guess I will answer for myself, I live in Somers and I was Chief in Katonah, I work for the Town Of Bedford, I live 6 miles from Katonah, I responded from my House, to many calls, I did use it as a " Commuter car" for my 3 years as chief,I am allowed to leave work to go to calls.

Did I do anything wrong? I followed the rules my District laid out and I signed when I was given the privelage of becoming the chief.

Did I do errands in the car ? Yes I did

Did I take the Children around Town and drop them off ? yes I did

Did I go out with my wife in the Car ? yes I did

I do not see anything wrong with what I did.

I would not respond with the children in the car.

I was out on my way to a dinner( FD Function) and did respond with my wife in the car. Maybe that is wrong

The car sitting in a train station for the day while th eChief is in the city, maybe be ruffling some feathers but if the powers that be okay take it up with them.

JIm Arena

[INIT915 1,119]

Jim

I thank you for you honesty!!!!!!!!

FYI to ALL at this point only 1 person has stepped up to be honest in 70 plus post. Do I agree with how the car is used HELL NO! Should it be my concern because I don't live there? Why not? Maybe I'm shedding light on a issue that can save people money! This issue touches all volunteer departments in the country yet I get people that say I'm stirring the pot? It sounds more like they are whinning! The truth will set you free my freinds!!!! Being Jim is the only answer I request the topic be closed!

Be safe and stop crying!!!!

A few things come to mind here.

1) You level of maturity with some of your comments devalues your standing. You may have something significant to say, but when you debase yourself to name calling, you lose your edge.

2) Just because many disagree with you, it fails to prove or disprove your point. Welcome to America, we can agree to disagree. A topic like the one you have started here is not black and white, no matter how much you wish it is.

3) Your upset that many have failed to "answer" your question to your satisfaction. You in turn have failed to answer several of the follow up questions.

Don’t take these debates so personally. Be the mature professional.

[markmets415 524]

Jim

I thank you for you honesty!!!!!!!!

FYI to ALL at this point only 1 person has stepped up to be honest in 70 plus post. Do I agree with how the car is used HELL NO! Should it be my concern because I don't live there? Why not? Maybe I'm shedding light on a issue that can save people money! This issue touches all volunteer departments in the country yet I get people that say I'm stirring the pot? It sounds more like they are whinning! The truth will set you free my freinds!!!! Being Jim is the only answer I request the topic be closed!

Be safe and stop crying!!!!

The topic has been closed at the starter's request.