mfc2257

Grabbed this off another site. This is so bad a**.
The Dog Who Cornered Bin Laden

Grabbed this off another site. This is so bad a**.
The Dog Who Cornered Bin Laden

So what was there that was not needed? R-4 is a stones throw from it's first due and NRFD has equipment on it's other rigs to get a job started. R-1 was a little further away from it's first due but YFD has a spare heavy rescue and the truck companies to cover. The technical rescue team would probably respond faster from playland than if they had to assemble on any other day. The helicopter was in service and WCPD patrols Playland anyway they were in their first due. Collapse Rescue, USAR, and the flatbed are support rigs and responding from playland probably wouldn't put them too far outside the normal response. The vollie equipment that was there was more than covered by the redundant volley apparatus that surrounds their district.
Conclusion: the career equipment that was there wasn't an example of waste. The vollie equipment that was there may be an example of over redundancy and waste, but until the fifetoms are dissolved in the Tri state area you'll not see any improvement.

Is this are we looking at here?
Montrose Ward Lafrance
Mt. Kisco IFCO Seagrave
TMFD Ward Lafrance
Vahalla FD Maxim
Rye FD Maxim
TMFD Seagrave
Ossining Maxim

There is a lot of knowledge here but we need to know more to help. At first Gowens Knight seemed like the logical choice but since then you've supplied some info that leads me to believe that you are looking for more of a second due engine, TL supply rig, and maybe a hose wagon.
Where are you?
How much of your first due contains hydrants?
How often as you called to establish non hydrant water supply for mutual aid?
What is your environment like... Urban, suburb, rural, BFE?
When your primary attack apparatus is OOS how does this rigs responsibilities change
Will this rig perform any additional services ( brush, extrication, etc)
What's the budget

No. Oversimplified, the second due engine is a regular engine that grabs the hydrant and establishes continuous water supply for the first due when operating in an area where hydrants are nearby and flowing acceptable amounts of water.
A supply engine is specifically designed to provide water supply in adverse conditions. These apparatus don't follow any one spec and can vary in design.... Some attributes to various supply engines I've encountered include some or all of the following equipment:
Front mount pump for smaller overall design and ability to nose into static water supply
2 man cab
Short wheel base
4x4 or 4x6 drive train to access remote water supply
Several thousand feet of LDH for long lays
Hose reels for long lays
High volume pumps (1750gpm+)
Pre connected front suction squirrel tails for rapid establishment of draft from static water source
Porta-Pond or drop tank to rapidly establish initial draft site for tanker operations
Water thief or hydrant assist valve
Extra adapters and fittings to facilitate unique connections OR achieve compatibility with neighboring water systems
Here is an example of Bedford FD E-108. Photo credit to emtbravo member BedfordFire via www.bedfordfire.com Notice the connections in the front bumper, the long looped length of suction tube, short overall length, two man cab (maybe three), and not seen from the rear... The 5000ft of LDH it carries.

At 20 years old I guess we couldn't expect you to understand how terrifying the cold war was because you were born a scant 12 months before it was over. The brave men and women of our armed services supported and manned B-52's that flew in a constant path 24 hours a day for nearly 30 years from middle America up past Greenland through the Artic and down the Alaskan coast to mount a moments notice strike to counter the aggression that the USSR had no problem using elsewhere. BTW those bombers never had to drop a single bomb. They just had to be there.

At 20 years old I guess we couldn't expect you to understand how terrifying the cold war was because you were born a scant 12 months before it was over. The brave men and women of our armed services supported and manned B-52's that flew in a constant path 24 hours a day for nearly 30 years from middle America up past Greenland through the Artic and down the Alaskan coast to mount a moments notice strike to counter the aggression that the USSR had no problem using elsewhere. BTW those bombers never had to drop a single bomb. They just had to be there.

The rest of America calls that a storm drain. A sewer takes waste water from your home and processes it for cleanliness. A storm drain takes runoff and at best has a basic catch mechanism for debris that rolls in off the street. You cleaned debris from a storm drain.

Your point of view is honorable with regard to the fire truck. I disagree with it however as do I object to your notion that we think of our selves more than others. The taxpayers of this nation (and lets face it the 80/20 rule applies to those I'm referring to as taxpayers) have funded the rest of the world's problems for years. We need to be taking a better look at what is going on right here at home as we have done more than our part across the globe. In 2008 (the most recent data a could quickly come up with) the USA gave $49,057,000,000 in foreign aid to the rest of the world... Forty-nine billion.... That's $158.24 for each individual populating the USA (let alone citizens... or people who actually pay taxes for that matter.)
I'm not advocating never giving a dime overseas again, but rather that we take a better look at where our money can be put to use right here at home. If that rig was needed in the USA then here it should stay.

Your point of view is honorable with regard to the fire truck. I disagree with it however as do I object to your notion that we think of our selves more than others. The taxpayers of this nation (and lets face it the 80/20 rule applies to those I'm referring to as taxpayers) have funded the rest of the world's problems for years. We need to be taking a better look at what is going on right here at home as we have done more than our part across the globe. In 2008 (the most recent data a could quickly come up with) the USA gave $49,057,000,000 in foreign aid to the rest of the world... Forty-nine billion.... That's $158.24 for each individual populating the USA (let alone citizens... or people who actually pay taxes for that matter.)
I'm not advocating never giving a dime overseas again, but rather that we take a better look at where our money can be put to use right here at home. If that rig was needed in the USA then here it should stay.

Your point of view is honorable with regard to the fire truck. I disagree with it however as do I object to your notion that we think of our selves more than others. The taxpayers of this nation (and lets face it the 80/20 rule applies to those I'm referring to as taxpayers) have funded the rest of the world's problems for years. We need to be taking a better look at what is going on right here at home as we have done more than our part across the globe. In 2008 (the most recent data a could quickly come up with) the USA gave $49,057,000,000 in foreign aid to the rest of the world... Forty-nine billion.... That's $158.24 for each individual populating the USA (let alone citizens... or people who actually pay taxes for that matter.)
I'm not advocating never giving a dime overseas again, but rather that we take a better look at where our money can be put to use right here at home. If that rig was needed in the USA then here it should stay.

I hate negative firefighters press, but I'm not sure that this article is an unnecessary attack on firefighters. Read carefully and the article appears to be relaying facts and not filled with personal opinions of the writer.
The husband was arrested too. It would be wrong if only she was arrested and they mentioned him by name and his position as a firefighter...
"A Wilton fire department lieutenant and his wife -- a former stock broker -- have been arrested in New Canaan..."
"Funds from the victim were paid to charities, credit companies and other financial institutions, then transferred by Halloran and Michelsen for their own personal use, police said."
"One "charity" was supposedly created to support firefighters. Michelsen is a career firefighter and the president of the International Association of Fire Fighters Local 2233, according to the town. Neither the Wilton Fire Department nor the union was implicated in the scam, according to police."
There are plenty of rags out there slamming our brothers.... This guy, just like if he were a Mayor, Town Supervisor, Foreman of the DPW, or any other public official has been named and identified by profession.

Your point of view is honorable with regard to the fire truck. I disagree with it however as do I object to your notion that we think of our selves more than others. The taxpayers of this nation (and lets face it the 80/20 rule applies to those I'm referring to as taxpayers) have funded the rest of the world's problems for years. We need to be taking a better look at what is going on right here at home as we have done more than our part across the globe. In 2008 (the most recent data a could quickly come up with) the USA gave $49,057,000,000 in foreign aid to the rest of the world... Forty-nine billion.... That's $158.24 for each individual populating the USA (let alone citizens... or people who actually pay taxes for that matter.)
I'm not advocating never giving a dime overseas again, but rather that we take a better look at where our money can be put to use right here at home. If that rig was needed in the USA then here it should stay.

That is awesome. I LOVE to hear that.
Millwood (the "other" Wood) did the same with the Kenworth E-248 in 2004. It's serving in Witts Springs, AK. It served us well for 22 years and when the folks arrived to pick it up we threw them a party. They were so happy. Not a dry eye in the house. Many other local departments donated equipment including a power unit and hydraulic tools. I believe CVAC donated their Crown Vic fly car as well. Slick Willy hosted them at his place on the other side of town for a while as well.

I hate negative firefighters press, but I'm not sure that this article is an unnecessary attack on firefighters. Read carefully and the article appears to be relaying facts and not filled with personal opinions of the writer.
The husband was arrested too. It would be wrong if only she was arrested and they mentioned him by name and his position as a firefighter...
"A Wilton fire department lieutenant and his wife -- a former stock broker -- have been arrested in New Canaan..."
"Funds from the victim were paid to charities, credit companies and other financial institutions, then transferred by Halloran and Michelsen for their own personal use, police said."
"One "charity" was supposedly created to support firefighters. Michelsen is a career firefighter and the president of the International Association of Fire Fighters Local 2233, according to the town. Neither the Wilton Fire Department nor the union was implicated in the scam, according to police."
There are plenty of rags out there slamming our brothers.... This guy, just like if he were a Mayor, Town Supervisor, Foreman of the DPW, or any other public official has been named and identified by profession.

The issue in the NY area isn't that departments are having trouble getting out.... The BIG issue is that the power to go next due is placed in the hands of the department that is failing to respond when it should be in the hands of the dispatching agency. Yes all volunteer agencies have issues getting out from time to time. When they do, it shouldn't be up to the department that is failing to render aid to throw in the towel, the dispatcher should be able to alert the next due on a pre determined timeframe.
If the State of NY had any balls they would be actively amending the home rule crap that creates this ego driven situation....
Here is how it should really go:
0100hrs - Tones ...... 60Control to X agency for trouble breathing at fairy land.
0101hrs - No tones .... 60Control repeating that X agency is due for trouble breathing at fairy land
0102 - Same as above
0103 - Same as above
0104 - No tones ... 60Control to X agency awaiting an emt or driver for trouble breathing at fairy land (because one or the other has arrived at the rig and reported such to the dispatching agency)
0105 - Tones .... 60Control to X and Y agency... Y agency is now alerted second due for trouble breathing at fairy land... X agency is first due and awaiting an emt or driver
But instead in Westchester we wait for the people who are already dropping the ball to make the call.
If an agency cannot mount a response in 5 minutes it is time to strike the alarm for next due. NY is one of the only places in America where apparatus is allowed to fail with no empowerment for the dispatcher to remedy the situation.

Roto-Ray... Either you love them or hate them. Personally I think a roto-ray in the center with a pair of Mars 888's on the outer edge of the windshield make for a great looking rig... At the same time though, flashing lights don't put out fires so I wouldn't break the budget for the several grand that a setup like that costs if the rig is lacking in other equipment...

THANK GOD(!!!!!) That you are not in any position of authority. A minute or two of quicker response isn't the difference between life and death, that's the difference between MANY lives and deaths! In my particular area of the city, we are fairly well covered. What I mean is, there are a lot of companies per square mile. However, with only one full assignment out 20 blocks north, we become second due engine to box locations 10 minutes away. Do you know what that does to overall response times? Forget the public, how about that truck company that arrives 2 or 3 minutes before an engine in some cases? Those guys need to get in there to begin searching and the longer they have to do this without the protection of a hose line, the better the chances of catastrophe become. Considering we are losing our 5th man on many engine co's, the second due engines role of backing up the first hose line becomes that much more essential.
One thing that I must completely refute is your assertion that the FDNY needs to be run more like a business. This is wrong, plain and simple. It needs to be run in a professional manner of productivity and accountability, but it is not a business. A fire department is a drain, an expense. It is a cost that the municipality must incur in order to provide safety to the public. What we have now is, just barely, the resources to perform this task. To reduce in the face of cost would be criminal. It may appear that we could reduce our resources, but we cannot. Only in comparison with poorly staffed fire departments does this appear so. The simple fact is that most FD's are not properly staffed. Not at all. Staffing and resource conditions are the most important aspect of proper fire protection. The level of staffing in many areas and the idea of reducing staffing in NYC is an insult to the single greatest resource that most fire departments have and that is an extremely dedicated work force. How about bolstering that with the tools and manpower needed to perform the task and stop trying to figure out how you can best stretch and abuse the personnel on the street.
In New York City, the FDNY uses about 3% of the annual operating budget. For that small change, the 8.5 million residents and numerous businesses the best insurence policy money can buy. That's what a fire department is to it's municipality. The biggest and most versatile Swiss Army knife you've ever seen.

Spot on..... Chief Flynn has it right. These guys do a good job of promoting what the FD is doing so that the public can appreciate their work. Everywhere else the public might say "4 helos to fight building fires sounds expensive..." But a department like LA that does a good PR job the folks might say "I feel much safer because the FD uses helos to help us when a building is on fire"
On a smaller side note of PR, I used to have the guys open the bay doors whenever we were working on the apparatus floor so that the public could see what they were paying for and that there were people attending to it (volunteer or career, it doesn't matter)... Even if I was in the station alone, I'd open the two bay doors closest to the officers room while I was doing paperwork (weather permitting).
With cuts due to the economy and other financial drama effecting every aspect of emergency services, PR of any kind is great. This service has become one of a million that are competing for the public's dollars. Market your department like it was a Fortune 500 company so that the public will have you on their mind frequently. There are only so many times that the press is going to show our guys saving lives amidst all the other negative news that is out there.... Make sure your department is taking advantage of every opportunity they can for the public to know that you're there.

Date: 12/08/2010
Time: 2030hrs
Location: Orlando, Florida I/A/O I-4 and South OBT
Departments: OCSO, FSP, OPD, OCSO Aviation, OCFR, FDLE, other LE agencies
Description: OCSO LODD - Deputy shot in head while making traffic stop.
Links: Stories available at: www.wesh.com, www.local6.com, www.myfoxorlando.com
Writer: mfc2257
OCSO Deputy executing traffic stop was shot in the head by one of two perps in vehicle which fled to local apartment complex. One suspect found deceased from self inflected gunshot wound, other suspect contained within complex by 100+ LEO's and over 75 RMP's. Units going door to door A/T/T
Orange County Sheriff Demmings confirms Deputy has passed. He was 27yrs old. 4-5 years on the job and married to another Deputy of similar tenure and age. They have no children.

Pleasantville VAC just placed a rehab unit in service. If no rehab unit is available, detail an extra BLS unit and if there is a ladies or other auxiliary unit available get them mobilized. The extra BLS unit can handle the health/medical aspect of rehab while the auxiliary can provide hydration, nourishment. Rehab or extra BLS unit should be detailed when the second alarm is struck. BLS transport for victims or FF's should be on the road as soon as a fire is confirmed if not before... either as part of the first alarm or as an automatic add-on prior to striking the second.
Unless specific alarm instructions, preplans, automatic mutual aid, or box cards have been given to 60 control.... All you're getting in Westchester, for MANY departments is a simple dispatch for a fire that includes the first due department ONLY. The responding department has to ASK 60control to add resources. I hear it all the time... "gimme an engine from Yorktown, and the FAST from Croton and the Truck from Ossining. Start me tankers from Somers, Croton, Millwood, and Yorktown...." Some departments have done some primitive apparatus preplanning but very few have gone to the extent of detailing out for 60 control exactly which units are due on specific incidents and at what alarm level. When I was an officer in Westchester, I knew (for the most part) each of the surrounding departments apparatus and which capabilities they had. I created a box card plan for 4 distinct zones in the district (boxes) and alarm assignments for fire, mva, hazmat, etc through the 4th alarm with specific apparatus requests (ie; on the second alarm I want E146 from Chappaqua b/c its an LDH rig instead of E145 which had the 3in hose reel)...... It was completely disregarded by an old chief who didn't know which end of the hose water came out of and whom the other officers were too afraid to stand up to.
EMS needs to be included into such preplanning so that when an officer rolls up to a job and tells 60 control to strike the second, he/she doesn't need to waste valuable time thinking about who's ego he's going to stroke today with a M/A call.... Probably forgetting to ask for EMS coverage while he's at it.

I would err on the side of caution here with regard to whether or not their is theft. I have reviewed the publicly available budget information going back several years, and in plain sight as a line item, the funds are listed each year with a very conspicuous title "Station 3 Construction Reserve". The district has essentially squirreled away spare change over the years so that they wouldn't have to get a vote from the taxpayers.
The point that the district seems to be missing is that the money started in the pockets of the taxpayers. It didn't arrive under the Christmas tree every year as a $75,000 Home Depot gift card from Saint Nick. This is simply a case of smoke and mirrors..... The taxpayers said no when it went to referendum so the district made it a budget item. The only difference here is that instead of paying $75,000 a year in debt service and principal reduction on a note authorized by the tax payers, they use a $75,000 budget surplus to pre-fund the liability.... BUT it still comes from the taxpayer. If the taxpayers said no then each property owner should receive a pro rata reduction in property taxes for the amounts set aside by the district.
Again, this is not a rant against the firefighters of the Yorktown Fire Department. I will be the first to say that for the better part of a decade, I couldn't stand most of the commissioners of the Millwood Fire District. They made poor decision after poor decision with negative taxpayer sentiment growing with each ill conceived move. There is plenty to be learned from what has gone on with Millwood's attempt to build a new headquarters over the past 15 years. But those who don't learn from history are doomed to repeat it.....
I digress........

The Yorktown Fire District's southern lines are drawn in a manor that do not protect the citizens within its boundaries. I don't know many who will argue that Yorktown is a bad fire department. On the contrary, every time I've worked with them I've thought that they are professional, extremely well trained, and well staffed. At the same time, no one can argue that the membership base for the YFD is located north of the reservoir. There are areas of the district that are less than a mile from either of the Millwood stations where Millwood's membership is strong and able to respond within a timely manor. There are several areas that come to mind like the area of Shinglehouse Road in front of IBM where the YFD district begins, it's a mile from Millwood Station 1 and saturated with Millwood firefighters. On the other hand you can place a YFD substation on Rt134 a similar distance away that is in an area void of YFD firefighters. So maybe they'll get one or two members that live close, but by 2 in 2 out standards that apparatus will be useless until the remainder of their members arrive from north of the reservoir.
The answer here is to share a little more and spend a little less.
Yes as the lines are drawn, it is Yorktown's responsibility to provide protection to the ares south of the reservoir. Apparatus located in the vicinity without an abundance to staff that apparatus in a timely manor does not satisfy that responsibility. I would argue that responding from YFD HQ with a full crew that will be completely dressed and packed up when they arrive is more efficient than members driving their POV the same distance to arrive at a station and still have to don their PPV and respond in apparatus to the scene.
For many years MFC has indicated that they would respond to incidents on a dual response basis south of the reservoirs in conjunction with YFD. This same method works very well for Briarcliff and Millwood on the TSP south of Rt 100 where both are dispatched and those who are in need of aid receive it in a timely manor. I'm sure a similar arrangement can be worked out between MFC and YFD and even include a "mutual aid member" status for any YFD members who are in the area when a call comes in to respond on/with Millwood apparatus.

In a previous life, I worked extensively with MSP aviation, specifically Trooper 2 (Andrew's AFB) and Trooper 3 (Frederick, MD). These guys are amongst the busiest emergency services aviators in the US with Trooper 2 at one point (possibly still today) being the busiest air medical unit in the country. (On a side note, lets not forget the crew of Trooper 2 that was lost in a severe weather related crash while on approach to the AFB to meet a ground unit not long ago)
These guys are often the only folks that are in the air during adverse weather conditions. They also respond on a regular basis over state lines into PA, WV, VA, and in the District. Many times they are the only bird available to major incidents where multiple patients need to be transported. This may be one of the reasons for the larger airframe. They are truly a multi role aviation unit and thus the size of the Dauphin may not fit their growing LE, S&R, and air medical needs moving forward.
MSP Aviation Command operates 7 units with 11 airframes (one is actually based out of a tiny outcrop of WV that shoots into MD). The order is only for 6 new birds. I'm wondering if one of the Dauphins is going to stay in service or if they are eliminating a unit.