JJB531

How about just answering her question instead of giving her a hard time... is it really that big of a deal that you had to run on here to post tihs "horrible" experience you had? Did you ever consider maybe she was new?

Being that the City of New York/FDNY is the AHJ, and the FDNY is the City entity that provides Fire Protection for the City of New York, the FDNY Commissioner acting as an agent of the Mayor and the City can probably regulate Fire Services in NYC. His regulatory powers are vested by the City as a City employee of the municipal Fire Service which oversees Fire Protection. He may not be able to shut them down, but he can sure authorize or unauthorize them to respond to jobs within the confines of the 5 boroughs.

That actually had a LODD several years back and the benefits allocated was a big issue. Here's a link to a NYS appellate court rulings in that case:
Court ruling
Ruling link
Ruling Link

Being that the City of New York/FDNY is the AHJ, and the FDNY is the City entity that provides Fire Protection for the City of New York, the FDNY Commissioner acting as an agent of the Mayor and the City can probably regulate Fire Services in NYC. His regulatory powers are vested by the City as a City employee of the municipal Fire Service which oversees Fire Protection. He may not be able to shut them down, but he can sure authorize or unauthorize them to respond to jobs within the confines of the 5 boroughs.

They SHOULD document training. From what I have read on other discussion forums about this agency, they're not even recognized by the OFPC as a legitimate Fire agency. If that's the case, do they HAVE to fill out a training log as you asserted? Who is requiring them to if the governing body of VFD's in NYS doesn't even recognize them? So far everything I've read about this agency is that they are pretty much an unofficial, illegitimate Fire Department who has somehow enabled themselves to operate within the City of New York.
If the assertions made by the FDNY are true that their standards and training is sub-par, the shame is that they have not taken the appropriate steps to do what they need to do to be considered a resource or somewhat legitimate agency, not that the FDNY doesn't want them operating at their fire scenes.

I'm curious if the City is going to come out with an official position on the presence of independent fire companies operating within the confines of the City? Does the presence of these non-contracted agencies set a precedent that anyone can go out and buy a scanner and a fire truck and start responding to jobs?

They SHOULD document training. From what I have read on other discussion forums about this agency, they're not even recognized by the OFPC as a legitimate Fire agency. If that's the case, do they HAVE to fill out a training log as you asserted? Who is requiring them to if the governing body of VFD's in NYS doesn't even recognize them? So far everything I've read about this agency is that they are pretty much an unofficial, illegitimate Fire Department who has somehow enabled themselves to operate within the City of New York.
If the assertions made by the FDNY are true that their standards and training is sub-par, the shame is that they have not taken the appropriate steps to do what they need to do to be considered a resource or somewhat legitimate agency, not that the FDNY doesn't want them operating at their fire scenes.

I'm curious if the City is going to come out with an official position on the presence of independent fire companies operating within the confines of the City? Does the presence of these non-contracted agencies set a precedent that anyone can go out and buy a scanner and a fire truck and start responding to jobs?

Daily News Article Link

People are injured/killed intervening in law enforcement incidents all the time. However, and these are just a couple of examples, good samaritans saved countless lives when they retook control of Flight 93 on 9/11 and train riders subdued Colin Ferguson during his shooting rampage on the LIRR so there are examples.
These humans were trying to save other humans trapped in a burning building. They were not professionals nor were they probably aware of the hazards associated with their actions but they did try to do something when others routinely stand idly by. I won't be so quick to condemn them.

That certainly may be the case. But I personally won't vilify these bystanders for doing what they thought was right. They followed their instincts and a certain degree of human nature and attempted to help those in need, when no others could. I'm willing to bet that good Samaritans, over time, have done far, far more good than harm.

Training is extremely important in any emergency service field, but the realities associated with live incidents can only be partially recreated in training. Do any of these agencies have actual on-going fire prevention programs, or does their fire prevention efforts consist of handing out informational pamphlets once a year at a FD sponsored carnival or open house?

BNechis, it's interesting that you bring this up, because from a previous post in this thread, another member indicated that the following Fire Departments in Long Island didn't log a single working fire in 2011:
Bellerose-0
Floral Park Centre-0
Garden City Park-0
Stewart Manor-0
Meadowmere Park-0
Bayville-0
Sea Cliff-0
Merrick-0
South Hempstead-0
Albertson-0
Great Neck Vigilant-0
Plandome-0
Williston Park - 0
South Farmingdale - 0
I was wondering what this means for the experience these agencies firefighters are exposed to?

Although it has alot of space, that truck wouldn't be a convenient REP for routine patrol.

Being trained is great.... But do you have the proper equipment to put the training to use in the event of a real incident?

I think it's great that your agency trains it's members to the Awareness level, and keeps up with yearly refreshers, but Awareness level training is the bare minimum, and does not equip nor prepare responders to truly operate and respond to a radiological incident. It merely makes you "aware" that there is a HazMat release and the hazards associated with a radiological/HazMat incident, and the need to call for higher trained responders to handle the incident. It would be nice if EMS responders could be trained to at least the Operations level and be equipped to respond to these types of incidents.

Correct they should be required. This is why I asked what other agencies who have received grant monies in the past have done to improve their preparedness to radiological incidents. I didn't say Patterson didn't deserve any money, I asked why they received money when there are numerous other agencies that are closer. Did the other agencies previously already receive grant funding and were ineligible for additional funding this go-around? Was Patterson FD the only FD in Putnam County who applied for the grant? That would explain why they were awarded grant money.

That's great that Entergy has provided funding for these agencies for Training and Equipment. I'm curious how these agencies plan to use the money that was allocated to them? What will Cortlandt Community VAC do to prepare their members for an emergency incident related to Indian Point? What about Mohegan? Or Peekskill VAC? Or Nyack? Will their members be any more trained, educated, or prepared to respond to an incident involving Indian Point? Why did Patterson Fire Department, which is on the Eastern side of Putnam County, receive funding when there are numerous other agencies who are considerably closer to Indian Point?
What about agencies who have previously been allocated money from Entergy? What have they done with the grant money they received to improve their preparedness?

Although it has alot of space, that truck wouldn't be a convenient REP for routine patrol.

I'd still suggest that they be trained to the EMT-Basic level if for no other reason then the likelihood of injuries to their associates. Whether it be fireground, during training, or whatever the environment, having the extra knowledge could prove beneficial.

I think it's great that your agency trains it's members to the Awareness level, and keeps up with yearly refreshers, but Awareness level training is the bare minimum, and does not equip nor prepare responders to truly operate and respond to a radiological incident. It merely makes you "aware" that there is a HazMat release and the hazards associated with a radiological/HazMat incident, and the need to call for higher trained responders to handle the incident. It would be nice if EMS responders could be trained to at least the Operations level and be equipped to respond to these types of incidents.

Cobalt 60 is a commonly used isotope in the medical and Industrial fields. More then likely contaminated metals from a medical or industrial device were melted down and used to make these tissue boxes without any knowledge that they were contaminated. Obtaining radioactive isotopes is not significanly difficult. Improperly discarded medical equipment may contain Cobalt 60, Commercial smoke detectors contain Americium 241/243, commercially available soil density probes contain Cesium 137, etc.
Also if you read the article, these items were discovered to be radioactive when a truck carrying the tissue boxes was intercepted after setting off a radiation detector. A further follow up investigation was conducted and it was discovered that the tissue boxes were in fact radioactive, leading the NRC to get involved. Despite what you may believe, it doesn't seem there's more to this story other then the straight forward facts that has been presented so far.

Cobalt 60 is a commonly used isotope in the medical and Industrial fields. More then likely contaminated metals from a medical or industrial device were melted down and used to make these tissue boxes without any knowledge that they were contaminated. Obtaining radioactive isotopes is not significanly difficult. Improperly discarded medical equipment may contain Cobalt 60, Commercial smoke detectors contain Americium 241/243, commercially available soil density probes contain Cesium 137, etc.
Also if you read the article, these items were discovered to be radioactive when a truck carrying the tissue boxes was intercepted after setting off a radiation detector. A further follow up investigation was conducted and it was discovered that the tissue boxes were in fact radioactive, leading the NRC to get involved. Despite what you may believe, it doesn't seem there's more to this story other then the straight forward facts that has been presented so far.

Cobalt 60 is a commonly used isotope in the medical and Industrial fields. More then likely contaminated metals from a medical or industrial device were melted down and used to make these tissue boxes without any knowledge that they were contaminated. Obtaining radioactive isotopes is not significanly difficult. Improperly discarded medical equipment may contain Cobalt 60, Commercial smoke detectors contain Americium 241/243, commercially available soil density probes contain Cesium 137, etc.
Also if you read the article, these items were discovered to be radioactive when a truck carrying the tissue boxes was intercepted after setting off a radiation detector. A further follow up investigation was conducted and it was discovered that the tissue boxes were in fact radioactive, leading the NRC to get involved. Despite what you may believe, it doesn't seem there's more to this story other then the straight forward facts that has been presented so far.

EMS Operations in Crime Scenes
Katonah-Bedford Hills Volunteer Ambulance Corps
160 Bedford Road, Katonah, NY 10536
January 25, 2012
1930hrs - 2130hrs
Course Overview
This course is designed to provide awareness level training for EMS personnel on how to effectively and safely operate within the inner perimeter of a crime scene. The following topics will be covered:
*Crime Scene Characteristics
*Types of Evidence
*Responding, Approaching,and Operating within a Crime Scene
*EMS Priorities
*Preservation of Evidence
*Patient Management Considerations
*EMS Documentation
*Violence Against EMS Providers
This course is presented by Police Officer/Paramedic Joseph Bucchignano. For more information or to register contact Karen Moore, Katonah-Bedford Hills Ambulance Corps, (914) 232-5872.