CFI609D

This is a good example of an arrival report

We are confusing arrival reports and size-up...again.
The arrival report is quick and concise radio transmission of what you are seeing when you first pull up on the scene. It usually does not wait for a full 360, but it more often than not contains a 270 because you should get a view of the A, B, and D sides.
On the other hand a size-up is an analysis of the incident that is done to formulate your strategy and tactics to be use in controlling the incident. Notice I said incident because it's not necessarily a fire that you are responding. A size-up is not a radio report. Its a thought process.
I don't believe there is such a thing as a size-up report. It there were, you would be on the radio for several minutes going through your thoughts as you run down the list of "She was a tall cow," "Twas wealth," or whichever acronym you choose to use.
The "preliminary report" or "initial progress report" is a short version of what you consider important after doing your size-up, what you have done up to this point, whether more resources are needed, and anything else pertinent, unusual, or of urgency to the situation.
If you talk on the radio for 1 minute (and in radio time, that's a lot), the fire has the potential of growing ten times its original size. Keep it concise.

I agree that size-up is not just for structure fires. The acronym I posted above is definitely geared towards structure fires. It is important to point out, however, that size-up is far more than a "reporting tool." Rather, it is a process that should be used in any and all forms of incident command or emergency management. Size-up enables incident commanders and other responders to more effectively prioritize and allocate resources at an emergency scene.

We are talking about two different things here:
1. Initial radio report for incoming units
2. Scene size-up
Yes, they should take place in tandem but a concise and accurate initial report will benefit from a thorough size-up!

We are talking about two different things here:
1. Initial radio report for incoming units
2. Scene size-up
Yes, they should take place in tandem but a concise and accurate initial report will benefit from a thorough size-up!

We are talking about two different things here:
1. Initial radio report for incoming units
2. Scene size-up
Yes, they should take place in tandem but a concise and accurate initial report will benefit from a thorough size-up!

We are talking about two different things here:
1. Initial radio report for incoming units
2. Scene size-up
Yes, they should take place in tandem but a concise and accurate initial report will benefit from a thorough size-up!

I agree that size-up is not just for structure fires. The acronym I posted above is definitely geared towards structure fires. It is important to point out, however, that size-up is far more than a "reporting tool." Rather, it is a process that should be used in any and all forms of incident command or emergency management. Size-up enables incident commanders and other responders to more effectively prioritize and allocate resources at an emergency scene.

First of all, size-up should be a continuous process for all firefighters and officers. Pre-incident size-up is just as important: we should always gather valuable tactical intelligence about the dwellings and hazards in our response areas. Use EMS calls, fire prevention inspections, or other routine responses as an opportunity to expand your knowledge of your first-due area.
There are a number of good acronyms which help us perform an effective fireground size-up. The one I teach is part of Chief Michael Terpak’s size-up curriculum. It is: “COAL TWAS WEALTH”:
C: CONSTRUCTION
O: OCCUPANCY
A: APPARATUS (including staffing)
L: LIFE HAZARD
T: TERRAIN
W: WATER SUPPLY
A: AUXILIARY APPLIANCES
S: STREET CONDITIONS
W: WEATHER
E: EXPOSURE ISSUES/HAZZARDS
A: AREA (of structure)
L: LOCATION & EXTENT OF FIRE
T: TIME
H: HEIGHT

I agree that size-up is not just for structure fires. The acronym I posted above is definitely geared towards structure fires. It is important to point out, however, that size-up is far more than a "reporting tool." Rather, it is a process that should be used in any and all forms of incident command or emergency management. Size-up enables incident commanders and other responders to more effectively prioritize and allocate resources at an emergency scene.

Everyone is looking at sizeup/preliminary report as an FD structure only report. These reports are useful to incoming units and bosses on all types of calls from a structure fire to an MVA to a Ped Struck to a school evacuation. Putting information out such as number of patients, staging area, best access route, hazards, etc. will aid in units getting a clearer picture of what they are "walking into" while enroute. It can also aid a boss in escalating an assignment prior to arrival based on information at hand. The important thing is to think outside the box and do not pigeon hole a reporting tool as only useful for one type of call.

"Tear down this Wall". Those famous words were once spoken by the late President Ronald Reagan. Those were the words he once said to then Soviet Leader Mikhail Gorbachev. He was referring to a large cement and brick wall topped with razor wire, which physically divided the City of Berlin and the entire country of Germany. On the West side of that Wall in West Berlin, was a Free Country and Free Demorcracy. On the East side of the Wall in East Berlin was a Communist Country with no Freedoms.
Recently I had the opportunity to visit one of the Stamford, Ct Firehouses. I was invited to the quarters of Engine 8 which is on Vine Rd, about seven tenths of a mile south of the Merritt Parkway. That evening when I got off the Parkway was a firehouse to the left. I was later told that is Turn of the River Fire Depts quarters. A large, maybe three bay firehouse, that really isn't that old. So I headed south and three traffic lights was Vine Rd. Turned left and Stamford Fire Station 8 was right there.
When I got there I found a trailer mounted on a slab and a seperate single bay garage with the words Engine 8 on the top of it. It reminded me of some firehouse in the middle of nowhere in one of our very poor rural areas. This certainly wasn't what I expected to see in Connecticuts Fourth Largest City, in one of the richest counties in the country. (Fairfield County, Ct). That firehouse is the home of Three Stamford Firefighters, One Officer and Two Firefighters per shift. When I got there we talked about some of the older rigs that Stamford FD had, and of course of the Stamford Fire Dept how it is today. With two firehouses within 7/10s of a mile of each other I asked; "why aren't you up the street in that other firehouse". The answer was:
"We Are NOT Allowed in There"
The Stamford Firefighters are NOT allowed in there. I couldn't believe that ! Instead the City of Stamford must pay rent for that property to operate that Trailer mounted on a slab as Stamford Fire Station 8 with a seperate single bay garage. I asked how long they have been operating out of this trailer, and the officer told me, Four Years.
When a run comes in, these Stamford Firefighters must go outside into that garage, regardless of the the weather: snow, rain, wind, whatever, before they can get on the rig. All while a large firehouse, that is probadly empty sits Less than 7/10s of a mile away. In fact, while I was there, a run did come in. They responded to a call in one of the other volunteer areas. At that call was what appeared to me as a very young volunteer chief. Later I asked one of the Stamford Firefighters if that was the chief of the volunteer dept and I was told "yes, and he's 26 years old". Another shock that I just had a hard time understanding. Maybe he knows his stuff, I just wouldn't feel confortable taking orders from a 26 year old fire chief. Would you feel confortable taking orders on the fireground from a 26 year old ?
Now please understand, I am NOT putting that dept down. As I said, maybe that chief knows his stuff. In fact, I was actually pretty impressed with the members of that volunteer dept. And as I looked around, I happened to notice a well respected FDNY Officer from a very busy company, driving one of the rigs. He certainly has alot more firefighting experience than I ever did.
I was later told that there is also another Stamford fire station that is even closer to one of the volunteer firehouses that the Stamford Firefighters are NOT allowed to use and the taxpayers must pay the bills on that Stamford fire station also. I believe that is Stamford Fire Station 9.
Maybe there isn't a cement and brick wall with razor wire dividing the Fourth Largest City in Connecticut. But there certainly is a Wall in Stamford. It may not be physical, but its there. Recently a decision was approved to combine all Five Stamford Volunteer Fire Depts into one dept., and with one leader. A combination career/volunteer dept. I hope that this Wall can be torn down, just as that Berlin Wall was torn down decades ago. And the City of Stamford is only one example. Stamford just happens to be in the spotlight at the moment. There's more depts out there that also need to Tear Down Their Walls.

The City of New Haven CT will begin accepting applications for firefighter in March:
HOW TO BECOME A NEW HAVEN FIREFIGHTER: 2013 RECRUITMENT DRIVE
APPLICATION PERIOD: MARCH 11, 2013 MARCH 22, 2013
BASIC REQUIREMENTS AT TIME OF APPLICATION:
- AT LEAST 18 YEARS OF AGE
- HIGH SCHOOL DIPLOMA OR GED
- VALID CONNECTICUT DRIVERS LICENSE
FOR MORE INFORMATION ATTEND ONE OF THE FOLLOWING OPEN HOUSES:
NEW HAVEN FIRE ACADEMY
230 ELLA T. GRASSO BLVD
FEBRUARY 28
6:30 PM
HILL REGIONAL CARREER H.S.
140 LEGION AVENUE
MARCH 1
6:30 PM
FAIR HAVEN SCHOOL
164 GRAND AVENUE
MARCH 4
6:30 PM
JAMES HILLHOUSE H.S.
480 SHERMAN PARKWAY
MARCH 5
6:30 PM
Check this website frequently for informational updates
http://www.cityofnewhaven.com/fire/recruitment.asp

We all know what this job is about. This is one place that tradition comes into play in a meaningful way, and I don't care to hear from the naysayers and that "200 years of tradition uninterrupted by progress. I'm not talking about tactics and strategy, fog vs. straight, PPA. Those things are not tradition. A firefighter''s helmet is a symbol of who he is or who he was. Whatever style of helmet he wore is not the operative here. The symbolism here is that it is HIS helmet. Wearing this helmet he has accomplished things that the average person could not ever fathom. He has seen life and he has seen death. He calls anyone who wears similar headgear his brother because he knows where that person has been. If a firefighter meets his death on the job, it is his helmet that leads him to his funeral service.
My father passed away, non-LODD, when I was 15 years old. His helmet was solemnly and ceremoniously presented to me by one of his brothers. When my first son got on the job, I presented him with that same helmet. When my second son got on the job, I presented him with my old helmet. Those helmets are kept in places of honor in their homes. Why? Because that helmet says "That's who we are."
Politicians, City Managers, the general public, and unfortunately, some firefighters don't understand the symbolism. As for the rest of us, "You can leave this job, but you can't leave this job behind"
So, then, is that stinky, strange-looking hat worth $100?

We all know what this job is about. This is one place that tradition comes into play in a meaningful way, and I don't care to hear from the naysayers and that "200 years of tradition uninterrupted by progress. I'm not talking about tactics and strategy, fog vs. straight, PPA. Those things are not tradition. A firefighter''s helmet is a symbol of who he is or who he was. Whatever style of helmet he wore is not the operative here. The symbolism here is that it is HIS helmet. Wearing this helmet he has accomplished things that the average person could not ever fathom. He has seen life and he has seen death. He calls anyone who wears similar headgear his brother because he knows where that person has been. If a firefighter meets his death on the job, it is his helmet that leads him to his funeral service.
I just got this picture of my newborn grandson. I rest my case.

Nick has handled himself with dignity and restraint, given that this is a situation that has been ongoing for so long. Irvington has been most fortunate to have a firefighter so dedicated to a culture of firefighter safety. You clearly do not know him or much about the circumstances if you believe he "should leave the area." He did nothing at all wrong and has worked within the chain of command. I only wish we had more people like him.

The Chief upon hearing the complaint brought the complaint to the Village Administrator as he is responsible for investigating the EEO complaints. I believe there is a link to the report in the journal news article. As for the company I guess they decided to follow the villages findings. I guess the Company Officers felt the suspension the village came down with was enough? Remember The Company elects the Chief and the Chief is only one vote when an item is brought to the floor for a vote!

Nick didn't "bail out": he resigned from the "company" which is actually a social services and benevolent organization. At the time he was told by the village that he could do so. After seeking additional legal opinions, however, the village later rescinded its original opinion and he was told that he would have to rejoin the social services organization to remain an active firefighter, and that is where the dispute took off. Nick has been afforded the opportunity to rejoin the "company" but Nick has refused to do so as it against his principles and he sees the company as a source of much of the hostility directed towards him.
Nick is an outstanding firefighter and has been an incredible asset to the community. He is well known to all of the instructors in our region thanks to his dedication to training and mastering all aspects of firefighting. And yes, he is also very principled and refuses to compromise those principles. While I do not always agree with Nick, I have enormous respect for him. It is a shame that this has transpired and I hope that resolution will take place.
This law cited requiring members of a village fire department to also be members of a non-firematic social services organization calling thmselves a fire company is most unfortunate, and it is archaic. 150 years ago there were legit reasons to force firefighters be members of a company. But in this day and age where you have a municipal fire department and the company is no more than a social services entity (as is the case in Irvington, where the company has ZERO fire or emergency services role), this needs to be changed. I hope that perhaps this situation will prove to be a positive catalyst and that it will push lawmakers to reexamine obsolete and meaningless laws like this one.

Let us honor their sacrifice by doing all we can to better understand our common enemy: building construction and other hazards out there. Sadly the risks have only grown with the increased use of lightweight engineered building materials. Keep training and stay safe!

Once again Cap is spot on, its easy to put a sticker on your helmet that says "Never Forget," its quite another to actually remember.

I remeber we were sitting in the Fire House Kitchen when the news of the fire broke and live fotage was interupting whatever was on. We all said: "They do not realize that they are operating at a bowstring truss". We could see it on the news 10-15 minutes before the collapse.
I hate to say it but, the majority of the fire service has already forgotten this or never learned the leason of this fire (and others).
If we allow our firefighters to respond to and enter structures without understanding the hazards of different construction, we have forgotten.
If we fail to utilize proper communications (including seperate fireground and dispatch) systems, we have forgotten.
If we fail to have enough firefighters during the early stages of a fire and enough in reserve (FAST & Stagging), we have forgotten.
If we fail to regularly inspect (and preplan) structures and allow illegal and dangerious practices to continue, we have forgotten.
When span of control is exceded and ICS not utilized, IC get overloaded and can not protect the members, we have forgotten.

The above conditions still occur in many departments and we will again have another incident that we "Will Never Forget".
Does your minimum training include; building construction for the fire service?
Does your dept. know its district and the hazards in it? If you do not do inspections/preplans, than the answer is NO.
Do you have proper communications (every LODD report says most do not)?
Do you have enough staff, early enough and trained properly?
Do you have properly trained staff, with the resources to command and properly run a firefight.
I keep fighting this fight, because I do remember.
"Let no man's ghost return to say: MY Training Let Me Down"

Monies received by most fire companies I know generally goes to some of, if not all of, the following;
- Station amenities not covered by the district / municipality (this includes cable, phone, internet, furniture, furnishings, etc.).
- Retention events (picnics, dinners, etc.).
- Public Awareness / Recruitment (websites, "members wanted" signs, open houses)
- Community Give-Backs (funding a Little League team, etc.)
- Celebrations (Wet Downs [usually open to the public], Anniversary dinners / parades [often open to the public], etc.)
I really don't think anyone that writes a donation check to their local FD isn't doing so because they want to show their support to those neighbors of theirs who are coming to their aid when they need them. Often times they make comments like "I wish I had the time to help" or "I give you guys a lot of credit for what you do." The ones that don't donate are either doing it because they can't afford to, don't donate to anything or just plain hate us.
jumping up and down, screaming that all volunteer fire departments are ripping off taxpayers, using donations for lavish vacations just isn't true for all of us. We don't even send our Chiefs to trade shows anymore because we realized that more time (let's be honest - money) was being pissed away at meals and lodging. The money we get from our Village for training is used for everyone and no longer pays for 2 or 3 guys to "vacation" in Baltimore. Sure, you sit in on one 3 hour seminar each day, but how many hours of that same day are you at the pool or the bar?
None of us are perfect. And at the end of the day I think most of us will agree that our "system" (to be used loosely) is fractured in New York, but it's what we have and we are all trying our best to do what we believe in - right?
To Mr. Flynn, I appreciate how strongly opinionated you are. We share that trait and I credit it to our similar first name. And believe me, I hold nothing against any one person, one organization or one group of individuals. What I do have a hard time with is anyone that wants to degrade any group or organization for doing something wrong, when everyone (myself included) has made mistakes as well.
I think all of us on EMTBravo should stop making everything a debate and try to put our energies into more prudent efforts.
Let's start by agreeing on one thing - whatever that one thing is - and working TOGETHER to find a resolution. Nothing will ever come from all of us (especially yours truly) getting all hot and bothered here.
To all, I apologize for my lunacy in earlier posts, but I tend to get emotional when my department gets lumped into the poor choices some others (and I am NOT talking about Irvington, so don't hate me guys!) routinely do.
Thanks.

NYS decides what for you? The training that they provide or the training that is required?
FASNY has always complained that the training requiremens are too much, so OFPC reduced the number of hours in the FF1 class. OFPC for 20 years said it took at least 15 hours to teach the NYS and Federally mandated Hazmat Operations course. When the current FF1 class came out the kept the 15 hours of material and only allow for 3 hours to cover it. Since NYS Law says all firefighters (not vol, not career, not interior, not exterior, but ALL Firefighters) must be certified by their employer (and the courts have ruled that VFD's are employer for this) prior to responding to ANY Calls. So if you only follow NYS and your members have not had at least another 12 hours (inhouse) they are in violation of the law.
OFPC does not require Confined Space Training, but as Tarrytown found out state law does.
Rewards are a good way to retain members and thus I have no problem with rewards as long as 1) It is clear to the community that that is what the money is being used for and 2) the people being rewarded are actually performing the service that the community is rewarding them for. From the Patch articles it sounds like both #1 and #2 are at issue.
Do those making donations know that the money is being used to reduce fire protection during those times the members leave the community for these events?

Wow! Unfortu
Wow! Unfortu
Wow! This is such a shame! Thank you Mr. Kabelev and Mr. Natkin for speaking up about this. There truly are many good people like yourselves in the Volunteer Fire Service. We need to keep exposing this system for what it currently is throughout Westchester County so that it will be able to evlove into something we can all be proud of and that will truly serve those we are sworn to protect.
Also a big thanks to those posters on both sides of the issue who have kept this horse alive and motivated me to kep posting even though I haver been away on vacation. If this thread had been dropped we might not haver gotten to the point of having access to this very enlightening article here on EMTBravo.

I disagree Chris, respectfully. I think it is very important that we continue to take opportunities when available to educate the public concerning the fact that monies which are donated to volunteer fire departments rarely, if ever, are used for purchase of firefighting equipment, or for training, or such purposes, but rather the monies people donate to volunteer fire departments are used for parties, extravagant dinners, vacations and excursions, etc.
Also, it is important to continue to emphasize that although there are lots of dedicated volunteer firefighters, such as Nick, who want to do the right thing in regard to being trained, prepared, and ACCOUNTABLE, there are many other volunteer firefighters who take advantage of the system, collect pensions and other perks,use the firehouses as a social club, and who have extremely little legitimate training, are unable to provide the service they claim they provide, and are basically accountable to no one.