nfd2004

I can only add this relating to this topic. Either a group of people learn exactly what this fire service thing is all about OR when the time comes. somebody just might be forced to learn it the hard way.
 
This does not only pertain to fires either. If some soul is pinned behind his steering wheel screaming he can't breath while he waits for a fire dept to show up, rather than a some on duty staffed one much closer, that might be considered as well.
 
So its not just the guy chocking on some super heated toxic smoke, gasping for air either.  

In this case they have turned their backs NOT only on firefighters, but MORE IMPORTANTLY on the citizens they are assigned to protect. There is even a case where one career firefighter from a different nearby city has posted various statements on the internet going against this career department. All in an effort to defend the local volunteer dept that he belongs to.
 
 Will it take the death of a civilian to change this ? No, because that has already happened. The difference now however is that a newspaper article pointing out a past of no regard for human life by some fire commanders. That in addition to the fact that there is a record of several serious incidents now clearly documented over the last year and a half or so.
 
 Let me also add this, and Pete "FFCogs", you will understand this much better than others here will. Several years ago I was writing on a web site and commenting on some of the statements made which to me were totally inaccurate. I was contacted by that Norwich Career Chief at the request of some of the local volunteer fire chiefs. This was a fire chief that through a completive testing process came from another state. He had asked me to "tone it down" because as chief he was hoping to improve relations among the career and volunteer fire depts. I had never worked for this chief and I basically told him that I was not about to stop telling what I know to be true facts.
 
 My point is that if anybody tried to work with these individuals it was this chief. And if anybody read my earlier post here you also read how he tried to discourage me from going to the newspaper to report these incidents. Apparently it was his hope to try and continue to try and work things out after the first incident. That was unsuccessful and when three other serious events happened, it was time for some retired firefighter and citizen of this city to do something about it.
 
 Now as you read this, I also ask you to keep in mind the fact that I was a volunteer firefighter for five years as well. Coming from a very progressive combination fire dept that to this day, still functions using a group of volunteer firefighters. Of course not as many as there once was, just by the virtue of todays society beyond our control.
 
  In addition as some may know, I have a brother who retired from the Bridgeport (Ct) Fire Dept as Battalion Chief. He spent his entire career on the busiest companies in that city during a time when Bridgeport was burning every single day/night. Although not directly within the Norwich limits, his story is one of a nearby volunteer fire dept he joined. If I were the chief, I would think we had just won the lottery getting a guy like this. But that didn't happen at all. Apparently the chief there wanted no experienced career firefighters or chiefs around. As a result he no longer belongs to that small town fire dept. My brother was retired and willing to donate his time. He also lived within a quarter mile of that firehouse. He was willing to offer them his services but they apparently would rather not have it.  
 
  I can't put the blame on the Norwich politicians for that one. A place that has nothing to do with the issues involving the Norwich FD.
 
  What I find so different is how many volunteer fire departments throughout the state feel so different. For my friends throughout the state, as well as outside the state, who are volunteer firefighters there is a mutual amount of respect we share among each other. Just NO RESPECT for each other right here in my own neighborhood.

"v85", thank you for your understanding.
 
While I am at it, let me thank this web site for allowing me to tell my side of the story. As I read some of the previous threads on here, I soon realized that I am NOT alone. Other places have similar issues.
 
In most cases I believe it is NOT the peoples safety that concerns some fire service leaders, but rather their own self centered egos that leads them in this direction. And when it comes to the fire service, we all belong to the same club.
 
Any firefighter who has ever been deep inside a burning building can fully understand that is exactly what this thing called Brotherhood is all about - Volunteer or City Paid. "United We Stand - Divided We Fall". The fire service is not designed to serve of our own self serving egos for our own satisfaction. But for every single person out there who depends on each of us to be there for them in their desperate time of need.

 
That is very interesting. I'll pass that on. It could possibly be used as a "last ditch effort" to defend some so called Fire Commander the next time this happens. Because yes, "Big Brother is watching". That Big Brother is ready and willing to assist anyone affected by this style of fire ground tactics. City Officials, as well as those Fire Commanders, have been made fully aware of that. Whatever those Incident Commanders decide to do next time could very well put them in the spotlight of some type of legal action.
 
Would that hopscotch plan also cover the reason of not sending that fire dept that was only 1.8 miles away, fully staffed, while calling two other Unstaffed departments from 5 and 8 miles away respectively. What about the Haz Mat incident where a Haz Mat team was called from some 15 miles away, rather than the closer Haz Mat Team only 3 miles away. Might I also add that was fully capable of providing the two in/two out requirement.
 
 Does it work like that if a civilian or several people are trapped in a room above a fire who can't breathe. Their lungs being filled up with heat and toxic smoke and desperate to find a way out ? Would it still be a good idea to put that hopscotch plan into effect even for the closest or next closet department, as was the case in all of these incidents throughout that city.
 
The fact presented also that some chiefs will not call for a neighboring FAST CO because "they could get too emotionally involved" is certainly a new one to me. Would that same rule hold true in a place like New York City ? I was always told that it was the early stages of fighting a fire that firefighters might have the most need for the FAST CO. It's been a while since I attended any fire school but I sure am out of touch to the fire service of today.
 
"v85", please understand that I do appreciate your comment made here. You are only suggesting what could be the reasons for a fire department to operate under these conditions. However, the job of the fire service no matter where it is, is still to save lives and property. Whether those lives are the lives of civilians or firefighters who depend on their Brothers/Sisters to save their lives. That is really what it's all about. People in trouble and dying should certainly receive a much higher priority than worrying about not depleting another side of the city. Or even when it comes to protecting their property. Should a fire dept commander hopscotch a department while the nearby exposure starts to light up.
 
 As I have told many people in the past, "who would you want to respond if it were a close friend or family member in need of some quick life saving action" ? Better yet, what if YOU were the one trapped in that room trying to get out. All while the heat and smoke gets worse by the seconds and you can't breath. And you are unable to find your way out of your own house because the smoke is so thick. My guess is that it would feel like you are in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean trying to find your way back, except you are right inside your own house.

Here is an interesting video of a fire that occurred a few years ago in Norwich, Ct. This fire occurred in the area covered by the Norwich Fire Dept (career). Of course ALL Five of the city's Volunteer Departments were requested to respond. Yet according to the first few sentences of that newspaper article (Post # 1), if this fire had occurred in the Yantic Volunteer FD, that career Norwich FD would NOT be assigned up to and throughout a Fifth Alarm response.
 
Now what if that Norwich FD did NOT call the local five volunteer fire departments for this fire, but rather companies outside the city and from much farther away. Would that be viewed as a good decision ? It happens in the Volunteer districts within the city, yet no one has been held to answer to that kind of foolish decision.
 
 Anyway, here is that video in which the Norwich FD called for the FIVE Local Volunteer Companies. So should that Norwich FD operate in a similar mode to the five local volunteer depts. ?
 
 Hope this works.
 
www.youtube.com/watch?v=of0WF7O3lf4

No I agree with you. I would not run a fire department like that if I ever got the chance, and I believe it has changed in my area as well. 
 
I believe the historical reason was that by leaving some local companies back, they could guide the farther away companies about local knowledge and hazards.  Of course now with GPS and CAD and computerized preplans that isn't needed as much or at all anymore
 
as far as the fast team thing, I don't know about FDNY but when I was dispatching in Maryland the fast was always the 1st arriving ambulance served as the OSHA two out until the fourth due engine arrived and was the fast. 

Of course everyone is certainly free to express their opinion on this subject. No one is obligated to write to any web sites either. That is entirely their own choice.
 
I have been a resident of this city for 40 years. 30 of which was a firefighter, including an officer. Prior to that I was a volunteer firefighter in Fairfield, Ct, a combination dept. At that time among a large group of young volunteer firefighters all hoping to become career firefighters. After taking six firefighters test, I finally get the job in a place I knew very little about. I very quickly learn that I have entered into what I refer to as a "War Zone". I am hated by many for the sole purpose of being a career firefighter. I just could not believe how different things were here in comparison to where I came from just about 75 miles away.
 
 In one of the incidents I had mentioned to this newspaper reporter, one volunteer department responding to a house fire drove right by Norwich Fire headquarters while the members were training in the rear parking lot. The Norwich Firehouse was only 1.8 miles away. They could have walked to that fire.
 
  It should also be known that after the first incident involving a grease fire at a nursing home around January, 2015, I personally met, one on one, with the Norwich Fire Chief. He advises me to talk to the city manager. I do and that city manager declines to do anything about it. I also later find out that he is a member of one of the volunteer depts. I advise the Chief I plan to go to the newspapers. He asked me NOT to do that, apparently hoping for some comprise. I also went to the Norwich President of IAFF 892 as well. A Captain at the time, who also asked me NOT to push this hoping things could work out. I respectfully complied with their wish.
 
  Three more serious incidents go on and I advise the chief, the union president, as well as that city manager, that I have written documents involving each incident and how dangerous this is for both civilians as well as members of the fire dept. I tell them that I now plan to go to the newspaper about this. The Chief and Union President still is not in favor of me doing this. But the Acting City Manager, with only four more DAYS in office tells me "Go ahead and go to the paper". I had then told the Chief and Union President that as a 40 year resident and a retired firefighter, I was in the perfect position to tell this story. I owed no one and I was fed up with the total lack of concern for people of this city. "I really didn't care if people liked me or they didn't". I already knew that many already didn't for the sole purpose of just being a city firefighter. In fact, I never put any IAFF Union decal in my 2011 Nisson car window because of that.
 
  As word spreads that I plan to go tell this story, I am WRONGLY ACCUSED of being "Coached" into doing this. That is absolutely UNTRUE. Not one Norwich Firefighter pushed me into doing this. Most just assumed nothing could be done. "I was on my own the entire time" and that is a fact.
 
  I met with that reporter several times. A few times she had questions for me which she uncovered that were never brought up in the article. They could be headline stories in themselves.
 
  In 2009, there was a fatal fire only a few houses from the Norwich FD response area. In that fire mutual aid was called from much farther away from all volunteer departments. At that time, I should have gotten involved and I regret that I didn't.
 
 All I had asked was to have the Norwich FD respond if they were closer than other departments. If that had taken place, there would have been no Front Page story of a "Norwich's Fractured Fire Service".
 
 If any member of this site wishes to send any questions or comments to anyone involved, that is their every right to do so. I can also tell you that throughout the State of Connecticut, as well as Va, Fla, NY, and RI, after the release of this newspaper article, many friends of mine, both career and volunteer, retired and active, from firefighter to chief officers, just can NOT believe that any fire dept would operate under these conditions today.  
 
 Willy D
 Retired Norwich FD
 

Thank you for all you do.
You keep our country safe
Under the red, white, and blue.
 
That was written in a Thank you card by a young child and dropped off at a police station near me.

Thank you for all you do.
You keep our country safe
Under the red, white, and blue.
 
That was written in a Thank you card by a young child and dropped off at a police station near me.

Thank you for all you do.
You keep our country safe
Under the red, white, and blue.
 
That was written in a Thank you card by a young child and dropped off at a police station near me.

Of course everyone is certainly free to express their opinion on this subject. No one is obligated to write to any web sites either. That is entirely their own choice.
 
I have been a resident of this city for 40 years. 30 of which was a firefighter, including an officer. Prior to that I was a volunteer firefighter in Fairfield, Ct, a combination dept. At that time among a large group of young volunteer firefighters all hoping to become career firefighters. After taking six firefighters test, I finally get the job in a place I knew very little about. I very quickly learn that I have entered into what I refer to as a "War Zone". I am hated by many for the sole purpose of being a career firefighter. I just could not believe how different things were here in comparison to where I came from just about 75 miles away.
 
 In one of the incidents I had mentioned to this newspaper reporter, one volunteer department responding to a house fire drove right by Norwich Fire headquarters while the members were training in the rear parking lot. The Norwich Firehouse was only 1.8 miles away. They could have walked to that fire.
 
  It should also be known that after the first incident involving a grease fire at a nursing home around January, 2015, I personally met, one on one, with the Norwich Fire Chief. He advises me to talk to the city manager. I do and that city manager declines to do anything about it. I also later find out that he is a member of one of the volunteer depts. I advise the Chief I plan to go to the newspapers. He asked me NOT to do that, apparently hoping for some comprise. I also went to the Norwich President of IAFF 892 as well. A Captain at the time, who also asked me NOT to push this hoping things could work out. I respectfully complied with their wish.
 
  Three more serious incidents go on and I advise the chief, the union president, as well as that city manager, that I have written documents involving each incident and how dangerous this is for both civilians as well as members of the fire dept. I tell them that I now plan to go to the newspaper about this. The Chief and Union President still is not in favor of me doing this. But the Acting City Manager, with only four more DAYS in office tells me "Go ahead and go to the paper". I had then told the Chief and Union President that as a 40 year resident and a retired firefighter, I was in the perfect position to tell this story. I owed no one and I was fed up with the total lack of concern for people of this city. "I really didn't care if people liked me or they didn't". I already knew that many already didn't for the sole purpose of just being a city firefighter. In fact, I never put any IAFF Union decal in my 2011 Nisson car window because of that.
 
  As word spreads that I plan to go tell this story, I am WRONGLY ACCUSED of being "Coached" into doing this. That is absolutely UNTRUE. Not one Norwich Firefighter pushed me into doing this. Most just assumed nothing could be done. "I was on my own the entire time" and that is a fact.
 
  I met with that reporter several times. A few times she had questions for me which she uncovered that were never brought up in the article. They could be headline stories in themselves.
 
  In 2009, there was a fatal fire only a few houses from the Norwich FD response area. In that fire mutual aid was called from much farther away from all volunteer departments. At that time, I should have gotten involved and I regret that I didn't.
 
 All I had asked was to have the Norwich FD respond if they were closer than other departments. If that had taken place, there would have been no Front Page story of a "Norwich's Fractured Fire Service".
 
 If any member of this site wishes to send any questions or comments to anyone involved, that is their every right to do so. I can also tell you that throughout the State of Connecticut, as well as Va, Fla, NY, and RI, after the release of this newspaper article, many friends of mine, both career and volunteer, retired and active, from firefighter to chief officers, just can NOT believe that any fire dept would operate under these conditions today.  
 
 Willy D
 Retired Norwich FD
 

Just to explain a little better and follow up on the above comment about the FAST Co.
 
Why didn't the Occum FD originally call for the Norwich FD (Staffed), rather than the Yantic FD (Volunteer) for the FAST CO when they were both equal distance or LESS than six miles away ?
 
That is a good question that most of us in the Fire Service today can NOT really understand. Whether it be for a FAST Co response or to become actually involved in the incident, it is hard for me to remember the last time that career dept was called into any of those fire districts.
 
  It is my hope to spread the word way beyond the local city limits or this part of Connecticut, to show the world through that newspaper article and through the use of some fire dept web sites, just how foolish these decisions appear as they are viewed from the "outside world". Perhaps, before some innocent people suffer at the hands of these Fire Commanders, they will come to their senses through the embarrassment of their own decisions.
 
  Let me suggest as I did earlier, your concern and your help could may be just the right words to make these people reconsider. I'm sure you can do that through their web sites. You don't even have to tell your name. Just that your read what is going on and that change is way overdue. With your RIGHT WORDS telling them of these foolish, very outdated decisions, just perhaps, YOU may indirectly save a life that might not have happened otherwise.  

The Norwich FD members are all trained for FAST Co operations. However, the entire city of Norwich uses the Mohegan Tribal as a FAST CO.  The Yantic FD is also trained as a FAST CO. I think one of the reasons that the Norwich FD uses the Tribal FAST Team is because they are staffed around the clock and are able to reach any where in the city fairly quickly. Also the Yantic FD is NOT used as a FAST Co because if there is a fire in Norwich they could be assigned to the fire or relocate into that career dept.
 
But you are correct in thinking that the Norwich FD could have also been used as a FAST Co in this latest fire. I don't remember the Norwich FD ever being called into the Vol Area as a FAST Co. It just doesn't happen. For the Vol area it's either Mohegan Sun or Yantic.
 
In the days of horse and steamer, Norwich was divided. Not by any geographical boundary however. We used to say they followed a drunkin' cow around to set up these boundary lines. The boundary lines go from one yard to the next. Your next door neighbor or across the street neighbor could have a totally different fire department respond to their house. All within the same town with the same services except the FD.
 
In 2009 there was a fatal fire (Lafayette St). Several volunteer fire depts. responded from 6-8 miles away. All while a career dept of nine guys remained in their firehouse less than two miles away. Only a few houses separated that response.
 
  Its a outdated mess and some think that everything is going along just fine as is.

On Tuesday, July 5th, another fire. TWO DAYS after a front page and a full page article appeared titled: "Norwich's Fractured Fire Service".
 
This fire occurred almost across the street from the first due fire company, the Occum Fire Dept. They along with the Taftville FD were dispatched on the initial call.
 
The Occum Fire Chief, Car 4, was on the scene within minutes reporting "Smoke Showing". He requested the Baltic FD (nearby Town of Sprague) as well as the Yantic FD (within Norwich) to stand by their stations. Within a few minutes, Car 4 requested Baltic to the fire scene as well as Yantic to respond as the FAST Co. While enroute, Yantic was reassigned to go to work and Mohegan Sun Tribal FD was assigned as the FAST CO.
 
Let us just focus on that Yantic FD response as Car 4 requested. Yantic is a fully volunteer fire dept. In this case they are a six miles from the scene. Now lets compare that distance to the On Duty Staffed Norwich FD.
   1) Norwich Engine 2 is staffed with an officer and two firefighters. They are one and a half miles closer than that Unstaffed Yantic FD. The distance Eng 2 needed to respond is 4.5 miles away. While Yantic was farther away at 6.0 miles.
   2) Norwich Fire Headquarters (Squad A, Engine 3, Truck 1, Batt 1) is staffed with nine firefighters along with a Battalion Chief. They are the EXACT same distance away as Yantic, Unstaffed at 6.0 miles away. Yet, this chief felt it was better to call an Unstaffed fire department with no idea of who might show up rather than a fully trained group of on duty firefighters.
 
  Within six miles of this fire the chief had the option of calling a total of 12 on duty firefighters or a volunteer fire dept with UNknown number of qualified firefighters. And in the case of Engine 2, they were even closer. He chose that volunteer dept instead. Which I think goes against every rule in the book.
 
  No talks have worked in the past. I had gotten involved over one and a half years ago, and all city officials as well as each volunteer chief was made aware of the request to make changes. A front page newspaper article confirms there are serious problems going on within the fire service here on as that July 3rd article pointed out called; "Norwich's Fractured Fire Service". It seems clear there apparently is no attempt to change things for the benefit of its citizens, as well as members of the fire service.
 
  I'm afraid the only answer is to follow through with some type of legal action once a tragic event happens. I will support any type of action necessary to hold any Fire Commander fully responsible for their action involving any innocent victims affected. I have also made that very clear to city officials, as well as each volunteer fire chief of these departments.
 
  It should also be known that the Norwich FD has no problem bringing in these departments as mutual aid companies. Seems to be a one way street coming in but not going out.
 
 Interesting that the Taftville FD was selected this year to host the upcoming Connecticut Firefighters Convention. It is considered an honor to be selected for this and the planning often starts two years ahead of time. It brings together about 500 fire departments. It is a major boom to the area hotels and restaurants. Many take part from large city's to the smallest rural areas, volunteer as well as career firefighters alike. Now with this "Huge Black Cloud" hanging over this city, will that have any effect on it's visitors. This convention is scheduled to take place between Sept 15-17th.

 I started with the First email over a year and a half ago. The days of talking are over. At least as far as I'm concerned. There's been talking going on for years. Certainly within this year and a half everybody is fully aware of the conditions that have existed. Yet despite that we see a total disregard for peoples lives or their property. Two days right after that newspaper story comes out is a clear show of total disregard for any body other than themselves.
 
I have about two dozen emails giving some very detailed facts. We also now have a Front Page article describing a very serious condition which exist. Not only firefighters aware of this now, but so is the public fully aware of it. I also have friends outside the city limits monitoring this as well.
 
 Unless something very positive happens in writing, the next move is to seek legal action in a court of law and hold the Fire Commander fully accountable for his/her actions.  I made that perfectly clear in my most recent email to a few city council members and have asked them to forward that to the chiefs and city officials.
 
If there is anybody on this site that might be willing to offer their suggestions here is a list of Volunteer Fire Departments within Norwich, Ct. You can contact them through their web site. They all need to come up with some very positive quick answers, in WRITING.
 
1) Yantic Vol FD
2) East Great Plains Vol FD
3) Taftville FD
4) Laurel Hill FD
5) Occum FD
 
 

THEY JUST DON'T CARE ! ! !
 
On Tuesday July 5th, another Working Fire. Only TWO Days after a Front Page headline story was in a local newspaper titled: "Norwich's Fractured Fire Service".
 
This July 5th fire occurred almost across the street from the Occum Volunteer Fire Dept., one of Five Volunteer fire departments within the city, along with one fully paid career staff. On the initial call the assignment called for a response of this Occum Fire Dept, as well as the Taftville Vol  FD.
 
On arrival of that Occum FD Chief he reported a Working Fire and smoke showing. Initally he requested the Yantic Vol FD to man their station as well as the Baltic FD (within the nearby Town of Sprague). Within minutes later he requested the Baltic FD to respond to the fire, as well as the Yantic FD to respond as the FAST CO. While enroute, the Yantic FD was reassigned to go to work on arrival. With the Mohegan Tribal FD (from Mohegan Sun Casino FD) now being assigned as the FAST Co.
 
  Yet, the Norwich Fire Depts Engine 2, staffed with three firefighters is actually 1 1/2 miles closer than that Unstaffed Yantic FD which is six miles from the fire scene. In addition, Norwich Fire Headquarters, staffed with Nine Firefighters and a Battalion chief is the exact same distance as that Yantic Fire Dept with being 6.0 miles from this fire scene.
 
About a year and a half ago, I started documenting several incidents in which the Norwich Fire Department with its 12/13 member on duty staff was closer to several incidents, yet they were NEVER ALLOWED to respond. Those incidents are listed as follows:
 
 1) Grease fire at a nursing home
 
 2) Major chemical leak at a Food Warehouse
 
 3) House fire with children trapped
 
 4) Occupied building fire at a "Half Way House", home to several occupants with mental or physical disabilities
 
 Now we add this apartment fire. It should also be known that in every major event within this city covered by that career firer department, it is ALWAYS one of the local volunteer fire depts. that are used as mutual aid per department policy.
 
  Each and every one of these incidents have been fully documented. There has been years before of this behavior as well. The time is long gone for talking. Unfortunately I'm convinced it will take a tragic event followed by some legal action to change things. Should such an event happen, I think it is safe to say that it will be the Fire Commander in charge of the scene who will be fully accountable for his/her actions.

 
Thank you "young man", I appreciate that.
 
Only a few days ago, a new acting Police Chief took over as the commander of this city's police dept. That new police chief wears TWO hats. One as Police Chief and the other as Chief of one of the Volunteer fire departments that responded to an occupied building fire right down the street (only 1.8 miles away) from a career firehouse with nine firefighters and a battalion chief on duty. Yet it was "his" decision to rather call for mutual aid from one volunteer dept 5 miles away, and another 8 miles away (from a different town).
 
 Now we have that same individual as Acting Police Chief, who is hopeful of that permanent position. Is this the kind of leader a city would want to be in charge of it's Police Dept ? A man who was very well aware of the problems that existed within it's fire department, yet did absolutely nothing to improve it. A man who was directly involved in one of the main causes for this newspaper article coming out. And by the way, as it appeared in that newspaper, the story was given front page headlines and also given another Full Page coverage as the story continued.
 
 Here is what I say about this chief of two hats. Every one of us is entitled to make a mistake once in awhile. In this case, there is no doubt that as fire chief he has made a very serious mistake. But no one was hurt. Had that one particular fire been later at night it could very well have been much different. In addition to that, this fire occurred in a community run "Half Way House". A place where people with both mental and physical disabilities stay for recovery. It has very limited staff on duty. I know this because I work a part time job there on the campus where this is located.
 
 So here is a "second chance" he should maybe consider. As Police Chief and Fire Chief, he is in the perfect position to correct a problem that has existed for years within the Fire Service of Norwich (Ct). The timing could not have been better. Let him join in with leading the way in the protection of these citizens from both serious crime and serious fires.
 
  This week, after the holiday, I intend to follow up with our city leaders on the release of this story. I am not about to let it die. In my next email I will suggest to those city officials how I see an individual who could really become a Role Model Leader when it comes to providing the most important services to it's city residents.
 
  As an individual he is free to choose which path he takes. His police position can NOT be held back for the sole purpose of his fire service leadership. However, I do think that should he decide to take what I consider to be the right choice and speak up for improvements within the fire service, he could clearly become one very well respected leader within this city.

 
 I must admit, it's pretty tough to argue that case clearly spelled out in black and white. So that is now well understood.
 
 So what do we tell the neighbors who see a fire truck show up as they scream; "There's somebody in that building". Do you tell them help is on the way ? The same one's that just applauded you as you marched by in the big parade. The same one's that were glad to buy you that nice big shiny fire truck you pull up in. The same one's who listened to your firefighter stories and could not believe how great you really are.
 
 Reminds me of a TRUE story I once heard. While attending a company picnic, one guy starts to talk about the big fire that he fought a few weeks earlier. Of course he apparently didn't know that another firefighter was sitting right there listening to the whole story as he was pounding down a couple of burgers. That other firefighter had not said one word about it, he just listened. The suddenly out of no where, one woman pops up with, "Oh Helen, isn't your husband a firefighter too" ?
 
 Well folks the secret was now out. As that hero firefighter asked "Well where are you a firefighter" ? I guess that other FF figured it was time to talk. he said I work at the firehouse right up the street from where that fire was. I was there and as I recall, you actually never went to that fire. "Didn't you just relocate with your company into the empty firehouse up the street" ? "In fact now that I think about it, when we got back, I actually remember seeing you there". "You really were never at that fire".
 
  You can just guess what it was like as his balloon just got a pin stuck into it.
 
  Motto of the Story. Just be careful what you say to people when it comes to you fighting fires. Make sure you tell them that you are "Exterior Qualified Only". You don't want anybody to get the wrong impression. Believe me, that was NOT the first time either.

I have always been under the impression that the term "Firefighter" or "Fire Officer" covers it all. So where should the certifications and qualifications end.
 
Do we break it down to a firefighter who might be qualified to force a door but not open a roof ? Or a guy who is only qualified to be a backup guy on a hose line and not be on the nozzle.
 
Let's not try to fool ourselves. Or worse, the people we are suppose to serve. "Either you're in it or you're not". A fire truck full of "Exterior Firefighters" will do absolutely NO GOOD to the occupant who is unconscious from heat and smoke, lying on their bedroom floor.
 
Wearing a badge and a uniform as an Exterior Firefighter, marching down Main St in the Fourth of July Parade takes a lot of balls. It's a totally false claim trying to be a firefighter marching in the same group. Maybe carrying a banner saying; "Exterior Qualified Only" would give credit to where credit is due. I have no problem with that, if that's the way it's done.
 
 I'm sure we have all gone to fires where the smoke and heat is banked down at the doorway and some guys suddenly "WISH" they were "Exterior Only" firefighters. In those few cases where it has happened, they became "INTERIOR Certified" whether they wanted to or not. That's when they get a real taste of what this "Brotherhood Thing" is really all about.

You seam to be the only one with a real problem.
 
sure lets take Port Chester out, I can change the name to many many other communities that believe the local FD is properly staffed when it is operating at such low numbers it can not even meet two in two out without mutual aid. These depts include volunteer, combo and career. My fight has always been about under staffing and calling people something they are not folks the public and the department.
 
last year acity councilwoman in another Westchester community made the comment that she was so proud of the 120 volunteers in their department. The Fire Chief almost fell out of his chair. He had to explain to her that most of the members were in their 70's and 80's and no longer responded to calls, but they were still "members". That brought the total number down to about 50, with only 18 or 19 being interior he said. And of those only a few were really active. In fact they average less than 2 interior firefighters responding to calls. 
 
Not too worry, their are plenty of members!

This is one of Hackensacks SADDEST DAYS. I remember it well. As x635 mentions it, this brought in a new awareness to a new way of fighting fires with truss roof construction. As I remember it, it gave a new awareness to how fires would be fought depending on the type of building construction. We learned that some roofs would actually collapse much quicker than others and in very large sections under fire conditions. A dangerous place to be on or under.
 
 It wasn't long after the Hackensack incident in which another truss roof collapsed killing six firefighters. This would be in 1978 when Six  FDNY members were operating on a truss roof at a Walbaums Supermarket in Brooklyn, NY.
 
  We learned how these light weight truss wooden roofs were held together with gusset plates having very little holding power. Roof construction became a big part of building surveys as well as the age of the building. Newer constructed buildings were actually more dangerous to firefighters than older buildings, by the shear fact that older buildings would hold up much longer.
 
  Those of us who were around won't forget seeing the desperate attempt those Hackensack Firefighters made trying to save their Brother Firefighters. Just as those FDNY members did. In fact they breached through a brick wall but it was too late.
 
  One firefighter was seen waving good by to his family from that Walbaums roof as they had just dropped him off at work. Minutes later that roof collapsed and he was one of six that were gone.  

Willy I have no doubt that you have the resolve to see this through and it is my most sincere wish that things there will change for the better. That said, true productive change can only come about when the considerations of all of the players are given equal voice. There may be many faults with some or all of the departments involved, but each has a horse in the race and needs to be treated as such. Hopefully ALL of the firefighters there will remember that they are firefighters first and try to lessen the divide rather than increase it to promote their own wants. I'm certain that things will change, maybe quickly maybe slowly, but they will change. I can only hope that the needs of the citizens drive those changes and not the whims of politicians or the self serving agendas of the players....otherwise all involved will be losers one way or another
 
 
Anyway, good luck on the road ahead. May your cause be just, your battle brief and the results a benefit to all.

Pete this thing started to blow up after several serious incidents took place with a total lack of concern for it's citizens or the members of the fire depts involved. Basically there was an out right refusal to have that career depat respond no matter how close they were or no matter a fire or a Haz Mat incident. 
 
After watching this kind of behavior go on I decided to try and do something about it. It just put too many people in danger with no regard whatsoever with their safety or concern. 
 
I kept my own records and ended up going to this reporter after nothing was even considered to change things. This went on for about a year and a half. I finally decided with nothing at all being done by anybody to take on the system myself. No one wanted to get involved. 
 
The only thing I asked for was to send the closest depts. Just common sense. It didn't happen. 
 
I am digging in for the long haul. Even it's its by myself. There is no valid argument for keeping things the way they are today. 
 
If the time comes where there should be one fire dept, then I'll move onto that next plan. 
 
My commitment is to the people of this city. Their lives come first. We can discuss how it should be paid for later. But first things first. 
 
Basically tiny little Baby Steps at first.

I can assure all involved. I know of ONE Individual who will get involved. His only problem is that he wishes he did this a long time ago. If so maybe one civilian would be alive today instead of dying in a house fire in 2008/2009 (?). That fire got no response from that Norwich, Ct FD by virtue of some imaginary dividing line within the same city. The fact remained that it was allowed to go on and often even condoned by city officials as well as a group of firefighters and their officers.
 
 Add to the fact that the firehouse closest to respond was that Staffed Firehouse with 9 firefighters and 1 Batt Chief. 
 
 I will assure everyone that if this happens again, I will encourage any innocent to take legal action against the city, the fire dept and the commanding officer in charge. My word is here in writing. I have many friends that live here as well who are aware of this problem.  

Thank you "10512". Now that this is known public information, should no improvements take place by this city administration, there is a public record of this.
 
As the individual who first contacted this reporter regarding this silly kids game, I have several emails which were sent in much more detail ( I have shared with others ) than was able to be printed in this story. My emails included videos of time as a factor to life safety involving a fire. Everything is very well documented. Based on some of those emails, the city politicians and the local fire chiefs could be held accountable should something go wrong in the future.
 
 There is a long history of such incidents as well. In one case, a civilian died in a fire in 2008/2009 (?) while mutual aid was requested from several unstaffed farther away places. All while a firehouse with 9 fulltime firefighters much closer never responded. The same firefighters that were required to spend 16 weeks, fulltime, in a fire academy to learn the skills of their job.
 
I believe that some of the local politicians realize this is a very serious problem and needs to be addressed. If not, a city along with it's fire departments, led by some of those fire chiefs could find themselves in a very serious position.