TimesUp

Because the chief of MVFD gets to tell 60 who he wants 1st, 2nd, 3rd, etc. as does the chief of GFD. Thats why it different for every dept.

If the criteria for sending M/A was who can do it without stripping the community, then almost every dept in the county could never send M/A.

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Yes Barry, theres a card with mutual aid assignments. The point is that it doesn't make sense. But thanks for the answer.

What Westchester needs to do is figure out away to combine resources so this sort of thing wont happen!

Greenville responding to MV. MV responding to Greenville. Either one doesn't make sense. Who the hell came up with that idea anyway?

Eastchester's TL-17 is dispatched on a 10-75? Even though they're down a truck with a working ariel and I saw something on another thread that they were down to one truck. WOW! Now I see why some of the Eastchester members on here are fed up with whats going on.

When you respond to an incident at one location you are also taking away resources from every other location in town, But thats considered acceptable, because we our main focus is the active fire. We relocate, use call back or mutual aid to cover the house, but ussually the community coverage is at a much lower level (i.e. 1 eng & 1 lad, when normal is 4 and 2). We think nothing of taking resources away from 99.9% of the taxpayers then.

This is true but your still covering the taxpayers.

Now if your dept. can not muster 12-20 firefighters for a working fire you either need to call mutual aid or you are shorting both your members and the community. And if you can not muster sufficiant members within the dept. then you need to call mutual aid. The key word being "MUTUAL". If you want it, then you need to figure a way to also pay it back. THat means taking away resources from your tax payers to cover someone elses taxpayers. If you don't want to d othat, then your taxpayers can support you to the point that you do not need mutual aid.

I agree with this as well but how can a department that can't muster 12-20 firefighter even think of sending firefighter out of town. Making it "not mutual"

There are lots of ways to deal with that, including getting the chiefs from the surrounding communities to jointly write that they will not cover that. We have seen it in Westchester. The dept itself needs to make it clear that having enough trained personnel in a timely manor is critical to everyones safety. To many times depts., chiefs and members are unwilling to say anything, because they are too busy pounding their chests.

Are you saying there was a time when communities got together as a unit and wrote a letter to a particular Town, City , or department and said "they would no longer respond" as far as subsidizing one departments short comings, I.E. Manning? Sounds good in theory, I just don't see it happening around Westchester.

Cogs brought up a good point. When you call for mutual aid your taking away resources from a town or city's taxpayer. Now once in awhile this should not be a problem. But what if becomes too often? Just asking because I know this could be an issue. Then there's the city manager or mayor who thinks he can lower the Departments manning because he can just call mutual aid. Although I'm in full agreement that most if not all fire departments around Westchester start the tour understaffed. I also know this is why consolidation has been studied.

There's no reason that we should try to do more with less. There's no reason for us to be breaking our backs and possibly putting ourselves in danger because some politicians are trying to cut costs. They look to cut staffing because it looks good on a spreadsheet and they view it as an acceptable risk. The plain and simple fact of it however is that with less men it takes more time to stretch a hoseline, do a search, or ventilate. We are only men, and we can only push ourselves so far before we stop functioning at our peak level or injure ourselves. One fireman can't do the work of three as much as we would all like to pat ourselves on the back and say otherwise. The most important thing for us is to operate safely and effectively, we all want to go home to our families at the end of the day.

I couldn't agree more with you Breeze. Well said!

Theres not a department around here thats not trying "to make do with less than they should" That goes for all of Westchester. Steve Cassidy will tell you the same thing also. Everybody is in the same boat. I'm sure your aware of that. Although its a good thing that this department is coming to grips with their problems.

Barry, Was this a meeting were fire service leaders are now saying they don't get called to the scene enough? Or don't get called for mutual aid enough? As far as one of the things you mention above, I cant understand how a department is ok with sending a piece of apparatus out of town when it leaves their town or city without coverage or a high percentage of their manning.

When I first got on I was told that " if it gets too hot to take a window" Well that doesn't always work too well. If you take the wrong window you can get somebody killed. Maybe yourself. Taking the wrong window can spread the fire. If your venting from the outside and start taking the wrong windows you can kill somebody inside or spread the fire vertically or horizontally. Anyway its not as simple as saying " if it gets too hot take a window. I've seen the results of what happens and what it turns into. But when done right with some coordination it can save lives and get everybody back to the firehouse sooner and safer. Go to 3min 30 sec

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bZzQibzeWtY

Delaying sending a call to the proper agency is just asking for trouble. Why anyone would want it to be routine is beyond me. Bad ideas are routine sometimes. Good luck trying to fix it.

Its a Tinker truck.......for tinkering.

I have two comments.

1. Ironic that today firehouse.com has an article on firefighter obesity!

2. You guys, and you know who you are, tell me some more about the greater levels of training and competency of paid 'professional' departments.

Oh yea!!!

This is Indiana. What their training standards are I don't know. I would have to say they're lacking in S.O.P's for Basement fires.

Basement fires can be rough, but taking a hoseline through a window down into a basement is unheard of. In the video you can't hear the conversation but you can see the tactic develop as soon as the one guy see's the fire in the basement window. I can't imagine why so many guys don't have turnout gear on, but in other videos by the same guy there is more of the same.

How to fight a basement fire?

Any ideas?

Another article and video interview of the pontiac fire union president

http://firegeezer.com/2011/12/29/pontiac-michigan-chooses-to-eliminate-entire-fire-department/

http://www.firehouse.com/news/top-headlines/michigan-fire-department-dissolve-merge-another

This should be interesting!

It also looks like Pontiac firefighters may get employment from the waterford fire department but the have to re-apply.

It speaks volumes when this guy falls from a second story window and his friends or fellow firefighters laugh at him. Besides this bad idea of bail out training. He's lucky he didn't break something or worse!

New Ro was put to the test last night with what looks like their first working fire without the 3rd truck in service. Will the Mayor be able to say there was no lapse in fire protection for his residents. Will the citizens be made aware that city hall is throwing the dice as far as fire protection in the event of a second call for a structure fire?

Go to 8:45. It shows a very calm,very orientated Deputy Chief assigning tasks and keeping up with any progress. He has an aid that is helping him with who's up next. But the calm he projects is what is key to me. I've seen it the other way and it makes for a interesting job.

Why would a Chief be standing on the cab putting out the fire? Were there no firefighters around? Its tough to run a scene when your operating. I don't think he'll do that again. Con ed told him its ok to stand on the cab and put it out?

I do. But it's not just me bro, go talk to any average Muslim about these issues. I think you'll find that they're not all Al-Qaeda sympathizers.

If they were would they tell you?

best time to stop by is between noon and 3 or after five, Have fun!

MV bought from VOLLIES.........OMG!

If you're going to buy a used piece of equipment its wise to buy from a volunteer department. Its almost always top notch with little wear or very low miles, or both.

Cog's, If the VFD"s are so concerned with saving the taxpayers money why would they want to sell their firehouses to the taxpayer? Wouldn't the vfd's save the taxpayers money if there was another solution. That is if it ever came to this.