gss131

I here you George, he's always trolling.

Then term "expedite" doesn't necessarily deal with response alone.It also can be termed to dispatch when ever another entity (whose response might not be as efficient) is needed on scene.If only to make it clear to their dispatch that time is of the essence.One scenario that comes to mind is Con Ed.When the call is made whether for gas or electric you are not always put on priority and when the seriousness of the situation is again relayed along with term "expedite",you may see quicker results.Other scenarios that come to mind for fire scenes include police for traffic control, or even salters/sanders from dpw. While dispatch may be waiting for the on call driver to call back ,maybe another driver should be contacted expeditiously.

I find that rarely do you hear us advising an expedite of FD units. Occasionally an expedite for ALS. But more common to hear an expidite for other agencies: PD, DPW, ConEd & Water dept. As previously mentioned that common expidite is not to have them drive faster, but to dispatch on a priority level.
We do commonly hear on EMS calls; PD requests an expedite. Funny most of the time, when thats requested our ETA is less than a minute.

Then term "expedite" doesn't necessarily deal with response alone.It also can be termed to dispatch when ever another entity (whose response might not be as efficient) is needed on scene.If only to make it clear to their dispatch that time is of the essence.One scenario that comes to mind is Con Ed.When the call is made whether for gas or electric you are not always put on priority and when the seriousness of the situation is again relayed along with term "expedite",you may see quicker results.Other scenarios that come to mind for fire scenes include police for traffic control, or even salters/sanders from dpw. While dispatch may be waiting for the on call driver to call back ,maybe another driver should be contacted expeditiously.

Then term "expedite" doesn't necessarily deal with response alone.It also can be termed to dispatch when ever another entity (whose response might not be as efficient) is needed on scene.If only to make it clear to their dispatch that time is of the essence.One scenario that comes to mind is Con Ed.When the call is made whether for gas or electric you are not always put on priority and when the seriousness of the situation is again relayed along with term "expedite",you may see quicker results.Other scenarios that come to mind for fire scenes include police for traffic control, or even salters/sanders from dpw. While dispatch may be waiting for the on call driver to call back ,maybe another driver should be contacted expeditiously.

Chris ,i don't believe i was criticizing anybody,but yet making a suggestion if you don't know the info ,don't start making up false numbers. This is half the reason the false bs is carried through to rags like lohud .Am i defensive ?you bet your A***. I'm tired of getting our balls wacked off and people right away fly off the cuff with false info.You want numbers ? i'll give you numbers.Our contract provides for 12 - 10 hr days of sick leave incentive, the same as every other agency in the city.Our members were out an average of 9.6 days. When you work a mutual into a 24, and you call in sick,you are being charged for 24 hrs against your sick incentive even though technically it was 1 day of being sick.So as quite the opposite of numbers being thrown around, i'll let the computation expert figure out how many 24 hrs tours it takes to accumulate 96 of sick time.

Chris ,i don't believe i was criticizing anybody,but yet making a suggestion if you don't know the info ,don't start making up false numbers. This is half the reason the false bs is carried through to rags like lohud .Am i defensive ?you bet your A***. I'm tired of getting our balls wacked off and people right away fly off the cuff with false info.You want numbers ? i'll give you numbers.Our contract provides for 12 - 10 hr days of sick leave incentive, the same as every other agency in the city.Our members were out an average of 9.6 days. When you work a mutual into a 24, and you call in sick,you are being charged for 24 hrs against your sick incentive even though technically it was 1 day of being sick.So as quite the opposite of numbers being thrown around, i'll let the computation expert figure out how many 24 hrs tours it takes to accumulate 96 of sick time.

After many fruitless searches to find archives of this massive blaze, I finally found a great website that has a
lot of the old Herald Statesman issues on PDF. Probably has a lot of other papers too.
Fulton History
As I mentioned in a previous thread, this was the biggest fire I ever personally witnessed in my life, and I saw it from the first alarm arrival, when there was nothing to see, right up to the full general alarm. I was on my way home from school, and what kid wouldn't stop and look when an Engine and Ladder stop on the street? This thing got going really fast, and just ran away from the firefighters. I attached the files with the full article from the Herald Statesman.
Yonkers NY Herald Statesman 1976 Grayscale - 7044.pdf
Yonkers NY Herald Statesman 1976 Grayscale - 7049.pdf

Thanks Chris. Exellent points. Just for clarification our additional alarms are normally 2 Engines and 1 Truck so that would be only 12 people total (all companies are staffed by 1 Officer and 3 Firefighters). The remaining Battalion Chief with his Aide (there are two on duty at all times) and the on call Deputy (no aide) come with the second alarm so the second alarm would actually have 15 members and all additional alarms would have 12 members.
We call mutual aide once we go below 3 Engines and 2 Ladders in the City and we do try to get them back to their municipality as soon as possible by freeing up in service companies as well as recalling off duty members to man spare apparatus which are normally equipped and ready to go. We also call in an off duty Battalion Chief with Aide to man a spare Battalion car and cover the city once we go to a third alarm. One thing we are lacking which we have been fighting for years for is 24 / 7 Fire Department supervision of the civilain Fire Dispatchers which would really help in situations like last night. There was a lot of scrambling behind the scenes to keep the city adequately covered, as well as get our off duty members in and out the door on the spares, send the mutual aid back, rotate fresh crews to the fire scene, transport injured or exhausted members etc. while at the same time maintaining accountability of everyone and everything....thanks to the mutual aid departments who came in as well as cooperation from union leaders, off duty members, etc. this was all handled pretty well last night.
Although you point out the benefits of certain aspects of our manning and organization, I would state that we are actually at a bare minimum right now and I couldn't imagine what would happen if we were forced to operate with less companies, less manning on the companies, or less staffing on the administrative side.

Unfortunately this does have to be discussed again. In light of the recent fires with places not being able to get enough interior qualified or even just enough personnel to the scene, I believe the chief raises a great point. Those who provide actual answers to the questions posed, and not just get offended and think they are being attacked, will not have a problem with the chief's questions.

I prefer to do it on here thanks. This way many more people besides me can see the answers, or lack thereof, and thus become informed regarding the extent of this very serious issue.
The silence thus far is deafening. There is much more specific information in the other thread regarding where and when the parades are than in this one. Why do you think that is?
BTW, you can call me John, Johnny, Chief, Mr. Flynn, Flynny, but please don't call me Flynn, it comes across as disrespectful and confrontational, even though I always remember to QTIP.

Thanks for making such a thoughtful and informative post.
Do departments from the lower Hudson Valley actually bring their apparatus to Lake George??

Thank you for your opinion. Would it be possible for you to provide any specific, factual information?

Great post! Thanks for the info. To the Mohegan career guys- hang in there! For clarification, noone is criticizing the efforts or tactics of anyone, career or volunteer who operated at this or mother recent fires (we're not complimenting them either, we just don't have enough info to speak on that issue one way or another and that is not the real issue anyway). The real issue is the chronically severe lack of an adequate number of qualified firefighters who are able to respond in a timely manner.
Where is the media on this?? I know many local reporters read this site. Where is the Mohegan Union? Again, I'm not being critical of the Mohegan Union- I just haven't heard anything publicly from you guys. Get the word out to the public and repeat is much as possible. Best case someone in charge will show true leadership and fix things before a real tragedy occurs. Worst case those in charge will be forced to fix things after a real tragedy occurs. However, if you don't go on the record publicly and repeatedly about the problems now, when a real tragedy occurs, the same old "we did the best we could" argument will be made, and nothing will change.

OK, I know the IA times aren't always exact however I have a question regarding the Banksville Fire based on what was reported in the IA.
1615 initial alarm?
1623 MA Tanker requested?
1627 Banksville Tanker responding?
It would appear from reading this that the first due tanker didn't get out of the barn until 12 minutes after the alarm came in...since I don't know squat about this area or tankers maybe someone can enlighten me...how many Firefighters are necessary to get the tanker on the road, isn't it only one? I assume this area has no hydrants? If the IA times are correct, why did it take so long to get the tanker responding, especially on a Saturday afternoon when I would assume would be the most ideal time to hope for an adequate response from volunteer Firefighters?
PS, How far in miles is the closest firehouse from this home?
Thanks!

A well worded reply. Good news is that someone had the correct information to explain what was going on. Bad news is that an explanation was necessary. We are all here to learn and share, not to be second guessed by people with no understanding of local geography, dispatch protocols, or equipment. It's getting a little old to read time and again how certain members disect every IA for precise times and raise questions that insinuate that things were not done correctly.

I'm sorry you feel this way but glad most others do not.
Yes, there is an agenda behind the question. I will again beat the drum here...I, and many others, believe that there is a serious problem in most parts of Westchester County with inadequate Fire and EMS coverage. For the most part, the public has no idea of this problem. I believe the problems can be solved through consolidation and regionalization. However, to solve this problem, we first need to educate both the public and many members of the Fire Service here in Westchester that there is in fact a serious problem. Questioning response times and manpower levels is part of this process. It is not personal, it is business. I do not "get my jollies from this", nor do I feel that I or my own department is perfect. I do realize that there are many (not most) who read this forum who are just chomping at the bit for an opportunity to criticize me personally or my department. Eventually you will have your opportunity I am sure. We all make mistakes and we all have areas in which we can improve.
SO, go for it when your opportunity arises...I won't cry, I promise...

As http://jukebox.lohud.com/photos/refers/index.php?gallery=Yonkers%20Firefighter%20Graduation%2001-15-10 barely a mention ,but at least the snooze posted some pics. CONGRATS TO THE CLASS OF 2009 ,GOOD LUCK and STAY SAFE>

As http://jukebox.lohud.com/photos/refers/index.php?gallery=Yonkers%20Firefighter%20Graduation%2001-15-10 barely a mention ,but at least the snooze posted some pics. CONGRATS TO THE CLASS OF 2009 ,GOOD LUCK and STAY SAFE>

As I stated in a previous thread, I had sent an email from my official Yonkers email account to the DES individual who is listed on their website as being the person, or one of the persons "in charge" of this "team". I had respectfully asked these same questions to him, explaining that as a Deputy Chief on the Yonkers Fire Department (and a former long time Captain of our Rescue Company as well as former NYS adjunct instructor teaching technical rescue), I felt that I should be aware of the capabilities (or lack thereof) of this team in the event that we might be working together at a large scale emergency. I received no response. I felt no need to pursue it further because in my opinion based on what I have seen and heard, the County Team is not a viable asset and should nort be taken seriously. I did however provide them the opportunity to begin a professional discourse and perhaps prove to me that my impression is incorrect.
The only times I have posted on this website regarding the County Team is to express my opinion after a previous poster has touted the capabilities of this "team". I have never criticized a particular individual on this "team", nor did I get involved in criticizing any particular incidents, such as the one in Hastings. The simple fact is that by any reasonable measure, the Westchester Technical Rescue Team, or whatever they are calling themselves, is not viable as a technical rescue asset and to purport otherwise is a disservice to those we are sworn to protect and may in fact cause loss of life in the future.

State Fire administrator has authority to create additional teams
NYC = NYTF-1
Capital District Team = NYTF-2
They have not designated any additional teams because they claim they do not have the resources ($$$$$)to validate any others at this time.
The Career Chief's have a template which utililzes over 9 dept's - The Yonkers team as well as the Squads from other career dep'ts.
Yonkers recently deployed over 50 personnel with a squad from Greenville (for a total of just under 60) to the Buffalo area for operation Vigiant Guard for a 4 day exercise. Outside of the 2 teams mentioned above there were no other NY resources there that were even close to our capabiltiy.
Why do I point this out - it is becasue of the politics on the County and state level of pandering to every little group out there that wants to be a State team. The state knows if they acknowledge any additional groups it would create a "me too" effect and they would not want to stir up that hornets nest state wide.
The career depts in Westchester have trained, have a "real" track record and the resources to be designated a state team - It has always been my contention that these other teams are a drain on the system and create unneccessary duplication and competion for the limited resources available ($$$$$)
All the nice tales of training twice a month and having been activated (????) all sound nice but we all know the the truth - but no one wants to hear it or say it
But it all boils down to they don't want to hurt any ones feelings by telling them they are not needed or especially never going to be capable of measuring up to what they say they can be.
"The Emperor has no clothes", Don't upset the apple cart - that is the underlying message
Maybe the new C/E Rob Astorino if he is really concerned about cutting ($$$$$$) will realize that the County Hazmat & Tech Rescue team would be nice to have but are really a waste of resources that are already provided through other dept's - they all want to talk about sharing resources but they certainly don't want to offend anybody. Especially all of of the volunteer (aka voters) team members and fire fighters.
So go ahead and bang my post with the negative rep points - the more attention that is brought to it maybe the truth will finally surface - and that is all I have to say about that!

"the Emperor has no clothes"
"No one wants the truth"
As long as everyone feels good about - BTW where can I order a hat & T-shirt for the WCTRT

What does "operational" mean??? Are they able to respond to technical incidents in a certain amount of time with a certain number of trained personnel? What are the training standards for this team? How often do they train? Are there any medical qualifications? How many members are on the team??

This might as well just be closed now, because the answers were not provided last time I highly doubt they willl be provided this time and its just going to set everyone off all over again.