SmokeyJoe
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Posts posted by SmokeyJoe
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Let's see what happens when one of these politicians house burns down. Odds are they'll be singing a different tune
JM15 likes this -
Sure, right after you explain to me what the hell that post has to do with anything we've been talking about.
I have to say, Nick's website provides an incredibly detailed explanation of his side of the story. Taking what he says at face value, because I haven't seen any explanation from IVFD, it sounds like he makes a great point. If all you want to do is respond to calls, why do you have to join both of these organizations and not just the Firematic side?
Good questions...where's the answer?
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Have we set a record yet? This has gotta be the longest thread ever.
Let's just just merge the districts into SFRD and be done with it. Enuf!
sqd47bfd and efdcapt115 like this -
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Maybe some one can clear this up for me? Who's in charge when you have two parallel organizations that cover the same membership? I'm pretty certain that on my job, not only would the person responsible for harassing another be disciplined but any or all of those officers whom granted tacit approval by their failure to enforce policy, laws and rules would also be disciplined. This is another example of a significant difference between career and non-career FD's. While I'm sure some non-career dept's provide supervisory training, my guess is that far less actually do and a percentage of those that do give the bare minimum, while some career FD's may follow the same, many (most I'm familiar with) require far more supervisory training and testing. This makes it clear who's required to do what and eliminates the "we didn't know" excuses.
Point of order: while I've had countless hours or supervisory practices, sensitivity training, diversity training, legal issues for supervisors, etc, etc, ad nauseum, when it comes right down to it, I already knew what was right and what was wrong as I'm sure most of us do, those that don't should not be given authority over anyone.
Very good points. It sounds like there is a real problem that has not yet been fixed. Where was the chief in all of this?
jruff04 likes this -
How could a fully career city dept. possibly combine with a combo career/volunteer dept?
I guess that is probably part of what will be reviewed. When North Hudson Rergiona Fire & Rexcue was created in NJ, they absorbed at least on FD w/vollies (Town of Guttenburg, I think?). I would look to see how they handled the process.
48 likes this -
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A new story about this situation is in todays Journal news:
What is as sad as it is shocking is the Village report on Nick's harassment claims:
http://www.lohud.com/assets/pdf/BH19158273.PDF
What a shame that a motivated guy like him has been treated so badly. And the Village is looking pretty lame in the way they have handled this.
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Once again Cap is spot on, its easy to put a sticker on your helmet that says "Never Forget," its quite another to actually remember.
Amen brother
Bnechis likes this -
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If that was such a good concept there would be more than a few hundred communities out of the 33,000 fire depts and however many police depts in the us.
Most places one service becomes the bastard step child and there is no one to bring the fight to the elected officials. With a police and fire commissioner, at least they get to argue the depts case.
As always, the good captain is right on target. Good point, B!
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I am not saying it's right or wrong, but legally, the individual fire companies are not public entities. They are merely social organizations, much like the Elks Lodge or Lions Club. There is no oversight because legally, there does not have to be. The meetings are closed meetings, the budgets are closed budgets, and everything else about them is closed. The buildings that they own are not public property as one might think. There is no legal requirement for them to "show the books."
Even if you went to FOIL them, I'm sure it would be shot down since the company is private and there is no legal requirement to disclose anything. What the village or district does with the tax money is all public information. every appropriation, receipt, and cent is (should be) accounted for and spent accordingly.
Asking someone to show the funds of a social organization on a public forum is not going to happen, whether you want/like it or not.
And what you're saying makes it scary that these people are getting and using tax $$s without anybody checking how and where.
Smokey Joe:
Since I left a long time ago I really have no clue to what the numbers are
Chris
As I expected
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A real loss. He was a gent and a standup guy
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Volunteer departments are not conduits for malfeasance, misappropriation, or misconduct regarding the use of donated funds, as they operate generally as a body of the overall governmental jurisdiction's (village, town, city, and so forth) authority. To make a blanket statement that donations are used more for recreational use than official department use, without any physically documented evidence thereto, does a disservice to the entire firematic community, paid and volunteer alike.
Looks like you may be wrong in the case of the IVFD. See the latest here:
JFLYNN and highwaybuff like this -
Chris, you said you are or we're a member of Irvington. How much does the company there spend on fire/rescue (equipment, training, etc) vs social expenses and parades? Do they have an outside auditor? From the article and comments on the patch it seems like there is nobody overseeing them.
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Well, I don't know about the reasons people donate, but whenever I explain to people what these donated monies are used for, they are virtually always shocked and outraged.
Based on the comments in the Patch I would say this is the case in Irvington too
JFLYNN likes this -
Bottom line: there are two problems here:
1) lack of accountability and mismanagement of donations by fire company (chief probably has zero csay)
2) abusive behavior directed towards and active member
Even if a fraction of what I have been reading was true, these guys really need to cleanup the mess and get their house in order.
highwaybuff and JFLYNN like this -
I disagree Chris, respectfully. I think it is very important that we continue to take opportunities when available to educate the public concerning the fact that monies which are donated to volunteer fire departments rarely, if ever, are used for purchase of firefighting equipment, or for training, or such purposes, but rather the monies people donate to volunteer fire departments are used for parties, extravagant dinners, vacations and excursions, etc.
Also, it is important to continue to emphasize that although there are lots of dedicated volunteer firefighters, such as Nick, who want to do the right thing in regard to being trained, prepared, and ACCOUNTABLE, there are many other volunteer firefighters who take advantage of the system, collect pensions and other perks,use the firehouses as a social club, and who have extremely little legitimate training, are unable to provide the service they claim they provide, and are basically accountable to no one.
Well stated chief. The company leaders in many NYS villages just dont seem to get it do they? This is not there money to play around with. Meanwhile they b**** about retention but when they get a standup guy like Nick they chase him away. Go figure.
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If you think we in the fire service are going to hae a shot in hell of out lobbying the building materials and construction industries, guess again!
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Wow! Talk about goin off topic! :-))
Back to the unions, yeah many of them have lost their purpose in life. Remember though that the IAFF for all it's pandering to Obama and the Democrats has taken a lead in firefighter safety. Both volunteer and career members have benefitted from their work.
in Opportunities
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Rest in peace brother. Thank you for your service and sacrifice.