Dumpster Fire In An Alley

[x635 4,066]

Sounds simple enough, right?

Jump on the Engine and let's go.

You are the Lt. on an Engine company, the only one dispatched to this incident. You have two firefighters and an apparatus operator. You can call for any additional resources you see fit.

You are dispatched to a dumpster fire in the alley between South 1st street and South 2nd street. You arrive to find heavy fire from a medium sized dumpster, halfway down the alley from where the photo was taken. Your access on the other side is exactly the same. On the left side, you have a resturant with a apartment residence above. On the right side, it is offices on ground level with apartments above. It is 8PM, and the sun is fading fast, but the fire is threatening to light up the exposures....what do you do?

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(Photo by me)

[x635 4,066]

OK, I know I'm answering my own question, lol.

The simple thing to do, IMO, is evacuate the exposures, use a deck gun to knock the fire down, while calling for the power company to shut off the utilities. When power is disconnected, assess damage to structures surrounding alley and stabilize, and then overhaul.

I know I'm probaly overlooking something here.

[Guest alsfirefighter]

I'd ask to fill out a structure assignment to be safe, ensure I have a water supply and put the fire out and immediately check the exposures.

[ENG47INE 17]

I'd ask to fill out a structure assignment to be safe, ensure I have a water supply and put the fire out and immediately check the exposures.

I Agree you can always retirn them if not needed better to be safe then sorry.

[x635 4,066]

I forgot to mention, there are transformers overhead the dumpster that's one fire......held up loosely by some very worn wood which is starting to catch from radiant heat......

[DFD801 0]

I agree with filling out the assignment... you'll need the manpower to check the exposures. I don't agree with the deck gun ... an 1 3/4 attack line will take care of the job and will put water on the fire and exposures immediately while giving your driver time to hook up the hydrant or hook to your second due pump if needed. I also don't agree with shutting off utilities. This is only an exterior dumpster fire outside a brick building. Check the windows above the dumpster for extension.... if it doesn't extend, you're good. No need to shut down an entire building.

[Guest]

OK, I know I'm answering my own question, lol.

The simple thing to do, IMO, is evacuate the exposures, use a deck gun to knock the fire down, while calling for the power company to shut off the utilities. When power is disconnected, assess damage to structures surrounding alley and stabilize, and then overhaul.

I know I'm probaly overlooking something here.

i wouldent use a deck gun id just send a crew with a line helf way down and stop befor the transformers o9ut of the way were there not over top of them and use it that way tell them to hit it from a good distense the prob. i see with the deck gun is if you accdently move it up not that its not up high already on a truck but hit the wood or the powerlines you now have a bigger prob. the pic dosent really show how high up the wood is it may not be that high up

[DaRock98 76]

Upon arrival I would prob fill out the assignment like ALS said, hit the closest hydrant and hook up my block party pack with a 21/2 going into 2 13/4 lines. Call for ConEd to shut off the utilities and send my first 13/4 line down the ally but have my men or women stand at a safe distance in front of the transformers. While my first line is attacking the fire have my second line protecting the exposures and keeping an eye on the transformers. I would also send crews inside both structures to see what is going on inside the two buildings. Just my 2 cents.

[FFD941 20]

Why risk the personnel? It's a dumpster... go with the deck gun first then move to a line once determined safe by the IC

[Ex-2114 7]

First - Request a full structure assignment and 2nd alarm assignment, along with a duty tow truck (if none of the apparatus on the initial assignment has a winch)

Second - request the power cut.

Third - Protect the exposures with dual lines (or old fashioned water curtains), begin evacuation

Fourth - Use the tow truck (or winch) and pull the dumpster away from the hazards, etc.... Even if it means to flip the dumpster on its side. This step will require 2 FFs to go in for the hookup.

Fifth - Use foam to quickly extinguish the fire.

The structure and 2nd alarm assignment will be used to aid in the evacuation as well as provide 'stand-by' crews in the event that there was extension. They should also be actively used during supression to ensure that there is no impingement.

Just my $.02

Edited July 20, 2008 by Ex-2114

[TimesUp 148]

I had a dumpster fire near an above ground fuel tank behind a school. The first thing we did was roll it away from the tank.

This might help here with the buildings being an exposure problem, and if they have wheels this might give you enough time to get a line in place.

[Guest alsfirefighter]

Why risk the personnel? It's a dumpster... go with the deck gun first then move to a line once determined safe by the IC

Unless you have a extend a gun that allows you to point the deck gun down, again you have to play with the pressure to get the stream to arch into a dumpster and so on. You'll blow half your tank trying to get it just right. It should take no more then a minute to a 1.5 mins. to stretch a preconnect and get water flowing at the most from the time that parking brake is applied. As far as the transformers...stay from under them. knock down the fire and if the wood is that much of a concern, a narrow to medium fog with the nozzle gated down just enough to cool the wood would suffice. Before anyone has a cow about water/electric this and that...it does rain right and if you use just enough water to do the job some downpours will be heavier. Again risk vs. benefit. If one of those buildings were fully involved would you think twice of protecting the other exposure by getting water onto the other building down that alley transformers or not?

Rock I like your thinking and have always like the flexibility a "blitz" line as I got used to calling them from Virginia offerred. It was 150' of 2 1/2" with a gated wye, with 1 200' 1 3/4" preconnected to the wye both minuteman packs. In the rear bed also was 200' of 1 3/4" with a nozzle horseshoed.

[ny10570 745]

Any time you have fire threatening a structure you should call out a structural assignment. Thats what, 100 - 120 ft deep? As ALS said, you're gonna spend more time positioning that deck gun than you would stretching a line. If you're that concerned about the transformers use the streams reach to knock down the fire then you can asses the condition of the transformers. As for the exposures, even if its just a brick facade you could have the fire knocked down before you get anyone evacuated. Put the fire out and ensure you have no extension and all you other problems go away.

[Monty 35]

As several have already said, fill out the structure assignment. In my old town, the dispatch procedures for a dumpster fire reported to be next to, near, against, in a building was automatically dispatched as a structure fire (complete with automatic EMS dispatch).

Don't know if any departments / 60 control do likewise?

[tdc202 0]

my first step would eb to fill out the structure assigment stretch a 1and 3/4 line minmal have the chauffer hit a hydrant get someone into the building with a 2nd line stretched and a thermal imager checking for ext. Contact power company to get the transformers shut down and stay back until they confirm power is down.

[M' Ave 1,466]

my first step would eb to fill out the structure assigment stretch a 1and 3/4 line minmal have the chauffer hit a hydrant get someone into the building with a 2nd line stretched and a thermal imager checking for ext. Contact power company to get the transformers shut down and stay back until they confirm power is down.

I'm not so sure I'd rush to bring a line into a building unless I was certain that there was some extension. We'd like to minimize damage from our operations when possible. Be ready with some guys at the back-step, but it looks like you have brick walls here, no serious exposure risk unless you are talking about a LONG duration and I would think that most medium size dumpsters don't even have the fuel to burn that long. Why not move a line in (smooth bore) and use the reach of the stream to knock the fire down. THere shouldn't be a need to put people under the transformers or even very close to them. Just proceed slowly and keep watch of the potential hazards. Hey, anyone ever consider a line from the roof, thus never being below the wires or transformers? THis could take a while though, considering the small isolated fire. A deck gun isn't bad idea, but it uses a lot of water. An adept enging should be able to knock this down with tank water. (Although hooking up to water should be a must) You definitly need a truck or two, in addition to your engine, for overhaul.

*Also, with overhaul and the TIC: that thing is a fun toy that MIGHT give you some insight, but there's no substitute for opening the wall.

THat's my simple 2 cents.

[tdc202 0]

My bad I thought I types stretch a line to the door at least just in case,. My bad