How important is knowledge of building constrcution to firefighting?

[x129K 1,393]

And is there enough emphasis placed on it in classes and training?

[64FFMJK 21]

since its a matter of life or death no there is not enough time spent on it it classes or training. How many Departments actively go out and preplan the commercial buildings in there district? How many Departments have a knowledge of where all the FDC's are in there district?

[antiquefirelt 994]

I may be biased having spent many years in the building construction business, but I feel this is a very big part of the job.

For the line firefighter it helps predict strong/weak points in buildings as safe areas. It helps predict potential layouts as you understand the reasons buildings are often constructed the way they are. Of course understanding how a building is built allows you to understand better fire/smoke/heat travel.

All of these issues are raised a notch when you become an officer and your decisions have a greater impact on the lives of others. Failing to understand construction can/has lead to numerous firefighter deaths and injuries. Too often we hear of firefighters being "surprised" by conditions that were predictable due to construction features or lack thereof.

We used to have a study group that went through Brannigan's book(among others) cover to cover. Having a few interested guys made what is fairly boring technical writing bearable and even fun. I can now see first hand some of that paid off as a few of the group are now officers and their understand of building construction is much better than others.

I also like to use building construction as an impromptu tailboard training session. Once in a while when we're taking up after an alarm we'll discuss the construction, predicted fire travel, expected voids, features that help/hinder and collapse potential. This gives the crew chance to share their experience and apply it to actual buildings we are in and out of.

[x129K 1,393]

One more;

In regards to construction, particularly of private residences, what is the biggest threat to firefighters and how do we recognize it?

[SRS131EMTFF 471]

The biggest threat to firefighters is by far and away fire behavior and time of notification. This concept has been drilled in my head every time I train. The concept that even after the fire is discovered, the first line will not be in the door for at least 5 minutes after discovery. Even if you catch a fire in the growth or incipient phase, even in career departments, the first engine will usually at least four minutes away and requires at least another one to two minutes to actually have a charged line ready to combat the fire. During this time, depending on the location of the fire, the structural members such as load bearing walls and truss support systems can become weakened and fail. Even if it is an older house, the time from discovery to the time of suppression allows for dangerous conditions to be present on the structure. In volunteer departments where you have to add another three to five minutes for POV response to the fire house or scene only adds to the danger that a well fueled and advanced fire will pose to its occupants and to members involved in suppression. In residential dwellings where 95% of my fires will occur, in my honest, yet inexperienced, opinion, the greatest risk to fire fighters is attempting to extinguished a well advanced, well entrenched, delayed notification fire that is not recognized by command. When we pull up and a working fire, our first instinct is to rush on in, put the wet stuff on the red stuff, complete our searches, save the occupants and save the structure. With delays in notification, limited staffing and modern construction, aspects affecting all sectors of the fire service, our job is mad more difficult because these are all hazards that prevent these actions and lead to situations where a fire is well advanced and we fail to recognize that. A point drilled home to me by my most recent instructors is even if there is no life hazard for victims, our priority #1, when we go in, we are that life hazard.

To answer your first question, no not enough time is spent learning about fire behavior and building instructor. You can only lecture for so long about building construction, going out and seeing it and realizing how fire can impact that behavior is far more meaningful knowledge. Unfortunately, most if the classes and burns I have had the opportunity to attend have not truly shown me what I would like to know, see and experience in regards to building construction and fire behavior.

[antiquefirelt 994]

One more;

In regards to construction, particularly of private residences, what is the biggest threat to firefighters and how do we recognize it?

Exposed lightweight floor trusses. Failing to recognize a fire in the basement of new PD's with this construction can and has lead to firefighters ending up in the pit of the fire. Truss roof construction may have gotten all the attention, but in PD's I'm far more concerned with first floor collapse than the roof coming down. Usually the roof a much more compartmented area, like the second and third floors (unless it's single story). Roofs over bedrooms and bathrooms will be less prone to land directly on you as the presence of wall will be more protective. The basement though is often a large uncompartmentalized space, more often with no ceiling to protect the truss joists. When the floor fails, there is little stopping it from hitting the lowest level.

Edited January 5, 2010 by antiquefirelt

[Guest]

since its a matter of life or death no there is not enough time spent on it it classes or training. How many Departments actively go out and preplan the commercial buildings in there district? How many Departments have a knowledge of where all the FDC's are in there district?

I would sure hope that if someone's a driver or officer in a department they know where every FDC in their first due is.

[64FFMJK 21]

I would sure hope that if someone's a driver or officer in a department they know where every FDC in their first due is.

I would too but I mean really know not "let me look it up in the map book"

[Guest BillyBlazes]

Frank Brannigan "The building is your enemy. Know your enemy."

[Chief1710 14]

Building construction is nothing new to use but it seems that it is finally getting the attention that it deserves. I started in this business as an Explorer and we had an Advisor that drilled building cont. into our heads. It is something has has stuck with me till today. I do feel that is does get less attention from some instrutors during FF1 than it does other but I don't think there given the proper time to cover it enough. I think that students don't realize how important it's going to be to them later on. Our department makes it a part of training program on a department level but it is something that comes up on a company level often.

On a side note we had a fully involved fire the other night and there was noway we were going inside. I was the officer of the first due and still took the couple of minutes to do the 360 sizeup. Just so I knew my enemy. I also continued to do 360's every 30 minutes at least just so i knew what was happening with the structure and the other hose teams.

[Guest ffjay376]

Building construction is one of those monsters that every firefighter should keep in the back of his and her mind. I bileve its as importent as know self rescue methods or how to dawn your ppe right. My question to every one is whos responsibleiblity is it to make sure every one knows what type construction it is..

[Lucifer 6]

You can not impliment good tactics at a working fires without knowing the type of construction. Knowing the type (fire-resistive, ordinary, frame) will dictate decisions and tactics. Where is this fire going and how is this fire going to get there?? How am I going to stop it? It all falls back on construction. Balloon?? Where are my lines going?? How am I going to remain "safe"?? Know your buildings! Key.

[Bnechis 3,961]

You can not impliment good tactics at a working fires without knowing the type of construction. Knowing the type (fire-resistive, ordinary, frame) will dictate decisions and tactics. Where is this fire going and how is this fire going to get there?? How am I going to stop it? It all falls back on construction. Balloon?? Where are my lines going?? How am I going to remain "safe"?? Know your buildings! Key.

If building construction is as important as everyone has stated (and I strongly agree)....how many depts require training in it to become officers and chief officers?

Edited January 6, 2010 by Bnechis

[Guest alsfirefighter]

I always stress to the brothers I work with and students I teach when the curriculum is appropriate that the 2 topics that every great firefighter needs to have an understanding of and that every fire officer HAS to have knowledge of is Fire Behavior and Building Construction. You have to know what type of building occupancy your dealing with, what type of construction is it made of, what are the risks and effects of fire on those materials as well as what type of fire you have, where it is, how much do you have, where is it going and as you implement your tactics based on both pieces of information are the conditions getting better or worse.

In regard to private dwellings, lightweight truss construction by far is one of the primary hazards to firefighters and as a brother mentioned...lightweight flooring. But keep in mind that its also whats above your head that can fall down on top of you also. Another hazard is the fire loading in private dwellings we deal with today. Furniture isn't often solid wood anymore, its fiberboard covered with veneer finish, mulitple pieces of furniture in multiple rooms, far more then I ever had when I was a kid. DVD and/or VCR players, TV's, video game players and even the foam rubber used in furniture today all made of hydrocarbon based products that put off a ton of BTU's and thick, acrid, very dark smoke.

Edited January 6, 2010 by alsfirefighter

[antiquefirelt 994]

If building construction is as important as everyone has stated (and I strongly agree)....how many depts require training in it to become officers and chief officers?

Brannigan's book is one of five on our reading list for testing for company officer. Many test questions come from this book as well as oral board review questions/situations that test building construction familiarity as it relates to tactical decision making.

The hardest part is that guys and gals seem far busier than ever. Few take time to study constantly, and read only what they can cram when an opening arises. We stress this is a poor method as our promotion turn around time is shortened since we agreed (Staff/Union) to have a posted reading list. Not only can complacency kill you dead, it can kill our career path!

[jcoppola 52]

Ask anybody who knows me as an instructor and they will tell you that I place an enormous amount of importance on building construction in my classes. Like Branningan said, "know your buildings".

Know how the enemy is going to behave in battle, its your only chance of survival.