TimesUp

"Working structure fire" where does this fit in?

Is it safer to operate off an arial? It depends on the angle,distance to the roof and the pitch of the roof. I would much rather climb a ground ladder to this particular roof than a arial extended 60-80 feet at a very low angle. Working off a ariel is not always safer. Seeing guys carrying tools while going up a ladder that is extended 50-80 ft at low angles would not be safer in this particular case or similar incidents. But if you don't position an arial in front you have less options from the start. Looks like a good job and a great stop!

Who said this roof was going to give? M' ave I'm not talking about all fires or all the time. But I am talking about this fire and when arial's are at such a low angle that climbing them is less than safe. And of course if the roof might be undermined due to fire don't go on it. Or work out of a bucket. Btw working off of a stick to cut a roof is no picnic, with it bouncing and the temptation to side load it. You could throw off its structural integrity. For "this" fire and those like it I'd rather climb a reliable ground ladder 24 to 30 ft up than an arial 40 to 60 ft out. Now were not talking about rescues cause if we are I might do something different but thats another thread.

Who said this roof was going to give? M' ave I'm not talking about all fires or all the time. But I am talking about this fire and when arial's are at such a low angle that climbing them is less than safe. And of course if the roof might be undermined due to fire don't go on it. Or work out of a bucket. Btw working off of a stick to cut a roof is no picnic, with it bouncing and the temptation to side load it. You could throw off its structural integrity. For "this" fire and those like it I'd rather climb a reliable ground ladder 24 to 30 ft up than an arial 40 to 60 ft out. Now were not talking about rescues cause if we are I might do something different but thats another thread.

Is it safer to operate off an arial? It depends on the angle,distance to the roof and the pitch of the roof. I would much rather climb a ground ladder to this particular roof than a arial extended 60-80 feet at a very low angle. Working off a ariel is not always safer. Seeing guys carrying tools while going up a ladder that is extended 50-80 ft at low angles would not be safer in this particular case or similar incidents. But if you don't position an arial in front you have less options from the start. Looks like a good job and a great stop!

The first thing is a "Non - Deployed Reservist" (meaning never deployed after basic and advanced training to a hazardous duty / hostile fire zone or on active duty) is not classified as a "Veteran". Reservists that have only attended training, and never deployed or entered active duty do not receive points or other benefits (Civil Service) currently as the system is set up in most if not all states. A veteran is defined as one who has served honorably on active federal duty for more then 90 days for other then training. Not everyone in the military is cut out to be Infantrymen. I think the same holds true with the fire service, not everyone in the military is cut out to be a firefighter. Hell we have firefighters that aren't cut out to be firefighters.
What most people don't know is the unemployment rate for our returning veterans is 14-18 percent (DOL stats). This is accepted as a low figure, its most likely closer to 20-25 percent. These men and women are our nations most presious resource, your sons, daughters brothers, sisters, fathers and mothers. They stood up and raised their right hand and served in harms way when the nation called. With the best of intentions they are returning to there lives changed forever from what ever they endured. Some have sacrificed their lives, other their health and countless others presious time away from their families that they will never get back (missed birth of a child, birthdays, graduations and holidays) many have deployed more the 6 times. Its not easy to be told you can't go home because the team needs you. So if a veteran gets hired over another non-veteran by what ever system they use I vote yes for it. And I can't be sure but I'll bet none of them scored a 70 to get on the job. Yes some cities gets it, most do not. I tip my hat to the city of Boston and thank them for looking out for the next greatest generation.

Less than what the 51 new FFs proposed in the SVFD plan would cost 5+ years from now.

Even though the call for a lift assist can come in at the worst time it never fails how the guys show how caring they can be. The person who fell off the toilet or out of bed is always embarrassed but very thankful. Some are as easy as two Guys lifting them up after checking for any injuries. Others will need 4 guys and a back board. Then Help get them dressed, find the remote or move whatever made them fall or arrange things around the apartment or house to prevent this from happening again.
At one lift assist we were met in the street by a healthy looking man who said his father had fallen. In the back yard was a elderly male wedged under a picnic table. He was in a wheel chair and was trying to plant tomato plants. Also in the back yard sitting there was his healthy 18yo grandson. One of the guys remarked with a straight face "you must be his Grand daughter" to which the kid who seemed un affected by seeing his grandfather wedged under the table said with a puzzled look "no I'm his grandson!" After getting him up and back in his chair we dug three holes and planted the tomato plants. All the while telling the son and grandson "don't worry we got it" BTW the man who fell out of the wheel chair was a amputee but other than that pretty solid for a 75yo. I think George said it best though!

I agree, well written post Joe. We didn't look at these calls as nuisance though.
We used to ride around the district and I'd spend a lot of time staring out the window at the neat row after row of little pink houses, block after block, ain't that America. Aided's, lift assists, water conditions, all the service calls gets all of that look behind the doors and locks of the little pink houses. The encounters would soften the hardest cigar chomping brutes of the job. They softened everybody.
There'd be the poor, frail elderly and oft neglected by remaining family or friends, victim; stuck in some torturous position for God knows how many hours, wedged behind a fixture, soiled, humiliate, scared, confused.
And the compassion that flew forth from otherwise stoic members of the services was always warming. Yet the whole scene always enveloped me. The old photos on the wall from when the husband was still alive, from their younger days of love, family, children, photos from later when those kids grew up, got married, moved on...
In the end, this poor compassion-needy person is stuck, helpless on the floor of her bathroom with acid burns from having been unable to relieve herself properly. Each and every single call, heartbreaking in a way. Makes the self-preservation instinct kick in for a lot. Trying to fit humor in some where when picking up.
In a way, Americans are all victims of our collective success, relatively luxurious compared with much of the rest of the world. Yet, here we are, all separated, elderly abandoned and left to their own means. Isolated. Alone. Half of everybody in this country has got some kind of head problem because of how we are all so alone so much even within the hustle and bustle of large populated areas.
Yeah, those lift assists. You've got to construct an iron ring around your heart for the time you do these jobs, because if you let all of that despairing into yours...it leaves scars.

Even though the call for a lift assist can come in at the worst time it never fails how the guys show how caring they can be. The person who fell off the toilet or out of bed is always embarrassed but very thankful. Some are as easy as two Guys lifting them up after checking for any injuries. Others will need 4 guys and a back board. Then Help get them dressed, find the remote or move whatever made them fall or arrange things around the apartment or house to prevent this from happening again.
At one lift assist we were met in the street by a healthy looking man who said his father had fallen. In the back yard was a elderly male wedged under a picnic table. He was in a wheel chair and was trying to plant tomato plants. Also in the back yard sitting there was his healthy 18yo grandson. One of the guys remarked with a straight face "you must be his Grand daughter" to which the kid who seemed un affected by seeing his grandfather wedged under the table said with a puzzled look "no I'm his grandson!" After getting him up and back in his chair we dug three holes and planted the tomato plants. All the while telling the son and grandson "don't worry we got it" BTW the man who fell out of the wheel chair was a amputee but other than that pretty solid for a 75yo. I think George said it best though!

The answer to the bullying problem is Boxing Lessons

We idolized and memorialized Whitney Houston, yet looked the other way concerning her well known substance abuse and tumultuous life with singer Bobby Brown.
Charlie Sheen is 45 and his story is all over the news because he is a
substance abuser, an adulterer, sexually promiscuous and obnoxious.
Lindsay Lohan is 24 and her story is all over the news because she is a
celebrity drug addict and thief.
Something as frivolous as Kim Kardashian's stupid wedding [and
short-lived marriage] was shoved down our throats, While........
Justin Allen 23
Brett Linley 29
Matthew Weikert 29
Justus Bartett 27
Dave Santos 21
Jesse Reed 26
Matthew Johnson 21
Zachary Fisher 24
Brandon King 23
Christopher Goeke 23
and Sheldon Tate 27...
Are all Marines who gave their lives last month for you. There is no
media for them; not even a mention of their names.
Young Men who most likely came from rural America seeking a chance
to better themselves and to serve this county.
Rest In Peace, and THANK YOU,TROOPS.
This was an email i got and wanted to share it

Just wondering I read the assigned units to this fire, is Hartsdale using the ladder loaned to them from FDMV or not. It states E-170 and E-171 were assigned to the fire but no mention of a ladder. As for Eastchester are they fixing L-15 and L-16 so they have 3 aerials again or just playing roulette, it seems unfair to the taxpayers their to send the only working ladder out of town so to speak, what if a fire happened in Eastchester while TL-17 was away.

When I first got on I was told that " if it gets too hot to take a window" Well that doesn't always work too well. If you take the wrong window you can get somebody killed. Maybe yourself. Taking the wrong window can spread the fire. If your venting from the outside and start taking the wrong windows you can kill somebody inside or spread the fire vertically or horizontally. Anyway its not as simple as saying " if it gets too hot take a window. I've seen the results of what happens and what it turns into. But when done right with some coordination it can save lives and get everybody back to the firehouse sooner and safer. Go to 3min 30 sec
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bZzQibzeWtY

One certainly could say the ventilation is one of, if not the most important aspect of fire control. Given that nearly every action we take causes some sort of ventilation or effects ventilation, we must understand how our actions affect the fire.

Or kill them. The statements you made were and incredible over simplification of a very complicated topic.
There is a lot of reasearch being done on the topic. Some of the findings fly in the face of what we have done all along.
I encourage everyone to take a look at the following presentaton.
http://www.ul.com/global/eng/pages/offerings/industries/buildingmaterials/fire/fireservice/ventilation/

I was thinking today while driving. Dangerous habit. Anyways,
Our core goal is to save lives and preserve property, while protecting ourselves while doing so.
Sure, a search team could find a missing person. A crew with a handline can extinguish the fire. A Truck company can open the door for those teams to do so. That's us serving the public.
But isn't ventilation really for us? Quickly ventilating a building can make it A LOT easier for those inside, is well duh! thing. How accesible are your saws? Do you, or will you, have a crew to complete this task ASAP?
What do you think? Do you think some IC's put this off? What is a reasonable time for ventilation for a typical two story garden style OMD?

Its a Tinker truck.......for tinkering.

This is Indiana. What their training standards are I don't know. I would have to say they're lacking in S.O.P's for Basement fires.

This is Indiana. What their training standards are I don't know. I would have to say they're lacking in S.O.P's for Basement fires.

You're young, so I'll give you the benefit of the doubt. Generally speaking, a smoking pile of debris 6 hours later does not count as a nice knock down or good job. Unless you're talking about the excavator that was used for overhaul, that did a good job knocking down what remained of the structure.

This is an interesting thread. IMO it really does a lot to demonstrate the mindset held by many members of the Fire Service in this region which is such a disservice to those we are sworn to protect and to our own fellow Firefighters....with the exception of helicoppers question regarding manpower (and he is a cop, not a Firefighter), and one other question and answer in regard to White Plains manpower, the whole thread so far is all about how many apparatus respond, with no mention of personnel.
Guys, Firefighters put out fires...Firefighters who are adequately trained and certified for interior firefighting and physically capable. A certain amount and type of apparatus, of course, is necessary, however, listing how many apparatus respond to structure fires is not only worthless in terms of assessing a department's capabilities, it is misleading.

Do you really feel that way with your statement? There comes a point when we must draw a line in the sand. Have you ever come off a real $h!tty 24 and said I need my 72 to recoup? Don't you think we want to spend quality time with our families? Don't you think that the fun of the siren and horns wears off after time and we really are at work? There is a thought in the fire service that we can reduce the number of employees to a certain number when it will becomes cost effective to hire overtime to man the spots and save on the benefits. This is a fact and it will work. Do you want to work every other day 24, away from your wife and kids ( some of you will answer yes ) and not have any kind of life? I don't and I am sure my Brothers from Scranton don't. So the fact is we are not millionaires who have money to burn. We want to get away from the crap for a few before we have to dive back in.

It speaks volumes when this guy falls from a second story window and his friends or fellow firefighters laugh at him. Besides this bad idea of bail out training. He's lucky he didn't break something or worse!

It speaks volumes when this guy falls from a second story window and his friends or fellow firefighters laugh at him. Besides this bad idea of bail out training. He's lucky he didn't break something or worse!