tjd1012

Honestly, and truthfully, you missed the boat on this. There are already MANY prominent IA FB groups.

re-kindle?

re-kindle?

re-kindle?

re-kindle?

Don't try too hard to follow his logic. First off, it's difficult for anyone who appreciates the rules of grammar and literacy, and second off, it's all plagiarized. So basically, all of his "thoughts" are stolen. That makes him a thief. There no lower creature in academia than he who passes off others work as his own. I just picked three random sentences in that post, and they are all, verbatim, off the internet.
http://www.ehow.com/list_6683091_negative-effects-labor-unions.html
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100921054610AAA0to0
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20091019184208AA8AYGx
If anyone wants to have an honest discussion about the pros and cons of organized labor, please step up, but if all you can do is steal others thoughts and pass them off as your own, your making yourself look like a fool.
(Besides, doesn't plagiarism violate forum rules? If not, it should.)

JF - Dont let LoHud off so easy! If it were me, I'd make an issue about them misquoting you in that March article.

Its up to the conductors discretion

First, what's going on here is that people are asking questions about problems which they are seeing from pictures and listening to from radio chatter which most of the writers on bravo find offensive. Secondly, everyone is also putting these questions in a format that other people on this website can never handle because they're being told what was done wrong instead of suggesting what could be improved for the next incident.
Instead of people ranting about what they don't like about Briarcliff's operation, they should put their opinions in a more constructive format... and for that matter, the people answering the questions should exert a little more control over themselves before getting all riled up for nothing!
I wasn't at this job so i cannot comment on the operation of this fire...However, maybe all the Departments in Westchester County can start by putting written orders into 60 control's CAD system for automatic dispatching policies. This in itself would solve the major debacle going on in many small communities at most major fires in this microcosm we call Wastechester!
Putting a truck in front or as near to a private dwelling fire or any other structural fire for at least the use of its ground ladders and specialized equipment is always a great idea. We don't necessarily need the aerial at this job but we're gonna VES the hell outta the bldg. more quickly and more efficiently with a couple of 24' extention ladders!
As for 5" across a street, with water loss or any imminent water problems, you do whatever you have to do to make sure there is a positive continuation of water for anyone working inside (especially those working above a fire). With that said, anyone experiencing water problems should be on the air giving an urgent to the IC with confirmation back from him that he and everyone else is aware of the situation.
As far as a FAST Truck goes, at minimum!, 2 firefighters need to be fully geared and ready to go to work outside of the IDLH if there are members operating inside of any area that is going to labelled as an IDLH atmosphere. If the IC decides he wants to relieve them with an additional team, that's his decision. But remember that the original FAST truck has hopefully been there since operations commenced and they know exactly what is going on from the start of the incident to the incident/fire being placed under control. If the incident is prolonged, they should be complemented with a unit which keeps them hydrated at all times. If they came on a TL which needs to immediately be placed into service for whatever reason, that's a different story... for another day. But note that if this does occur, we still need to keep the 2 in 2 out minimum in affect at all times until and additional FAST truck arrives.
Lastly, if anybody, whether a chief, lieutenant, or just a regular ff is running any type of prolonged operation where the men are going to be exerting themselves or overexerting themselves he/she should think of having at least 2 ambulances (BLS and ALS) and a rehab unit on scene--one bus for standby purposes and one for transport.
That's my 2 and i hope this thread doesn't go for another 10 or 20 pages like the rest of them do.
Stay safe everyone!

No we never used it that way however we did place victims on backboards and load them in the rear of the rescue while waiting for transport ambulances during multi victim car accidents.

Again, I must ask...what in tarnation is a tanker????

As for the rest, you know why I picked up on the undercurrents of volunteerism; a majority of your posts have to do with issues or supposed issues that are only resident within the volunteer system. (Response times, staffing levels, and the implications that a regionalized and consolidated - and no doubt career - department would better serve those in the Northern areas of Westchester county [the volunteer districts], to name a few.) While you didn't explicitly use the word "volunteer," you didn't have to; anyone who has ever read any of your past posts and then read this thread knows exactly what you were getting at.

This fire got a huge head start before anyone was ever aware of it- burning in the walls of an unoccupied home with rapid spread to the attic before any units arrived. Crews from Put. Valley, Yorktown, Peekskill and as I can personally attest, Buchanan, worked with Mohegan in an excellent and coordinated effort and kept the damage from being worse than it was eventually was. Should mutual aid departments be included on the initial dispatch? That is a question Mohegan should consider, at least during the daytime hours. We do it in the tri-village (Buchanan, Montrose and Verplanck)24/7/365 on all structure fire calls (even if it's an oven fire). The district with the fire is toned out immediately followed by the other two to man their stations. Works very well anytime of the day for all situations. Again- this fire was well involved before anyone even noticed and the crews did "make a good stop" considering what they faced. Not making excuses here Chief Flynn- just giving a little first-hand insight to what I experienced on scene.

105 views so far...I bet I can double that at least...

I don't know Banksville either, but a couple of points-
1) Even if the tanker CAN be operated solo, it may be the department or the Chief's policy that it has two people on it. I drive a tanker all the time. I can and have gone to many structure fires with it by myself. I have been told that wherever possible, I should have a shotgun rider if for no other reason than to help back me up if I'm on a back road, or to watch intersections as I approach. I prefer someone else with me, but I'm not sitting on the apron waiting for them to get to the station. Perhaps in Banksville, there is an order against solo rides.
2) Depending on departmental policy, perhaps the tanker is the last one out on purpose. My department has a policy of engines first, tanker secondary. First driver to the house takes an engine, second driver takes an engine, third driver takes the tanker.
3) Don't read too much into the fact that a mutual aid tanker was requested before Banksville's responded. It may be indicative of the Chief not thinking it would get out, but it is also possible that during size up, he realized that he had enough fire to require a tanker shuttle as opposed to just using what water he had on wheels.I hear it all the time where M/A tankers are requested before all of the initial response is out the door.

I dont know squat about this incident, tankers or Banksville. But Slayer, as for the whole "1st alarm" quetion; unfortunately, each (volunteer) department arranges their assignments to be put into the CAD at 60-Control if they so wish. I say "unfortunately" because nothing is streamlined and each departments alarm assignments can be greatly different. It can be a great advantage to set up your alarm assignments this way. This way, the IC knows exactly what he/she is getting when they call for a 1st, 2nd, 3rd, etc alarm.
For example, a 1st alarm in Buchanan is a full-dept response from Buchanan, Ladder from Montrose, Engine from Verplanck, FASTeam from Croton and Cortlandt VAC.

According to me, yes one.... but my Chief will always tell me to wait for a co pilot...
BUCK UP ??? is this a term that they use in the rest of the USA ??? I am not sure how this is done .....
hahaha

As I have indicated on here in other threads, I do not live in Westchester and am not affiliated with any of the agencies which have had the misfortune of experiencing a structure fire in the past few months that were the topic of IA's, nor do I have any acquaintances in any of these departments. I am as far removed from these incidents as can be, so it doesn't "hit close to home" for me or make me feel uncomfortable (according to Mapquest, the Banksville firehouse, for instance, is 50 miles away). I am also not trying to "brush this problem under the rug".
There may well be a response issue in Westchester, there may well be a need for consolidation and regionalization. I don't know. I asked in a post a week or so ago to cite any publicly available information from any source in the way of a study or position paper that addressed the issue so that we could all be better informed. Never heard a word in reply. Does one exist? Does anyone at the County level agree that there is a problem? Has the County Executive or any public official (town, city or otherwise)made any comments or taken any action to at least identify the issue? I don't know, give us some real information instead of insinuation, conjecture and speculation based on unreliable information in an internet posting forum.
Please, chief, understand the difference between the "issue", and the methodology with which one pursues that issue. There may be a valid point in terms of staffing and response times, but that issue and the pursuit of a solution is diminished when the pursuit is based on conjecture and less than factual information. If you have facts, then fine, share them with us. If you don't, then get some. You must have access to some form of records, as dispatch records must be public information available with a FOIL request. Get the dispatch records for the last month. Stucture fires in Banksville, Croton Falls, Somers, and Mohegan Lake come to mind. Wouldn't be a lot of work to get information on 6-8 incidents. Put some facts together in an organized, analytic way that proves your position. Do that, demonstrate the problem that you say exists based on IA's from anyone with a computer, and I'll be a believer. Until then, it's all conjecture, rumor and hearsay.
One last point, which I'll put in a separate paragraph in case Seth and the boys feel the need to edit it out. Read your last paragraph. "...you are easily upset...", "...you very uncomfortable...", "You are blaming..." and "...puts you in a small minority". Let' keep the discussion about the issue, and not a personal attack the minute someone disagrees with you.

If two people disagree on something and you don't care who's right, wouldn't that infer that you don't care about the issue at all?
You mention that you are not happy certain things becoming "two or three page threads on here"...if something becomes a two or three page thread, wouldn't that infer that it is a topic of interest to at least several people?
Please show me where in my comments i "opined on what should have been done"??
Who made an "endless barrage of criticism over every single incident"??
I have questioned response times a few times in structure fire IA's and I have done so for a reason. To establish whether or not there is a real systemic problem, we need to investigate whether or not there is a pattern, and not just one or two isolated incidents. I'll tell you what...as soon as I feel comfortable that the fire service in Westchester County on a whole recogjnizes and begins to deal with this serious problem in a healthy way, I'll stop occassionally asking questions about response times and manning levels at certain incidents.
I have not opined on much on here, I ask questions or state facts usually. I will opine, however, that you are easily upset over the issue because it hits close to home and shines a light on something that makes you very uncomfortable. You are blaming the messenger and your desire to brush this problem under the rug puts you in a small minority on this site apparently (and thankfully).

So there you go boys and girls,enough holes in the times to drive a tanker through. Did Banksville's tanker respond at 16:19 or 16:27? What arrived on scene at 16:28, E157, E158, or both? Read through this thread and see how different the times are from one person to the next. Who knows who's right, and who cares? Once again, a lot of Monday morning quarterbacking and commentary by people who were not involved whatsoever, speculating and criticizing with incomplete, inaccurate information. I fail to see what is gained by all of this. My two cents.

Thanks Mike. I was pretty confident that the times were exact but I was waiting for you to confirm it. So....could someone please explain why the Banksville tanker was not enroute for a Banksville structure fire until 12 minutes after the initial alarm? None of this makes sense to me. Is this the norm???

OK, I know the IA times aren't always exact however I have a question regarding the Banksville Fire based on what was reported in the IA.
1615 initial alarm?
1623 MA Tanker requested?
1627 Banksville Tanker responding?
It would appear from reading this that the first due tanker didn't get out of the barn until 12 minutes after the alarm came in...since I don't know squat about this area or tankers maybe someone can enlighten me...how many Firefighters are necessary to get the tanker on the road, isn't it only one? I assume this area has no hydrants? If the IA times are correct, why did it take so long to get the tanker responding, especially on a Saturday afternoon when I would assume would be the most ideal time to hope for an adequate response from volunteer Firefighters?
PS, How far in miles is the closest firehouse from this home?
Thanks!

Its a popularity contest.

And so it begins yet again.

Love the quote from the union "Too stupid to be true"
Chicago Sun Times
seems like every few years, about 10 or so, some knucklehead comes up with a brilliant idea like this. Even FDNY is facing this with the 6 out of 10 proposal, but at least that would have been off the ones that at least took a test. Cant wait to retire and move to the middle of nowhere away from stupid people