TSull

I was in a bar talking to a friend whom I had met when he and his family visited my firehouse several years earlier. As we talked, we were approached by 4 drunk guys who said they were "firefighters from London Fire Brigade here on holiday". They had overheard us talking, realized I was a Firefighter, and wanted to know if my firehouse was close by so they could visit. I said "no problem, the firehouse (not mine) is at 48th and 8th" (54 Engine/Ladder 4). I even told them to specifically ask for my friend, Steve, who was working. Out of the bar they stumbled and a 1/2 hour later I got a not-so-nice text from Steve telling me what he thought of me sending the guys for their "visit". I thought it was funny.

I believe the correct terminology is "the fire (or incident) is 'doubtful'" after the first full incident size-up. After that, the fire or incident is considered doubtful until the IC places the fire or incident "probably will hold".

What does a "parade" have to do with anything? It is the crux of the whole article/lawsuit. The article/lawsuit states that:

"the Brewster Fire Dept attended a parade on the night of July 11, 2013 hosted by the Mahopac Fire Dept. As is traditional and custom, participating BFD members were allowed to consume alcoholic beverages before and after the parade and were invited back to the firehouse for a social gathering after the parade. Upon Ratajack's arrival at the firehouse, there was a gathering outside of smoking members. Observing this group more closely, Ratajack noticed members including Steven Miller and Paul DeBartolomeo, who had chosen not to be in uniform or to march in the parade, drinking and socializing with members that had marched. Because parades are integral to a volunteer FD's team building and public visibility, the BFD has historically has not allowed members to join the social event following a parade unless they have marched in the parade. This group had decided to come to the party but had not done any of the work to prepare for the parade, to march in the parade, or to clean and return the equipment to service so that it would be available for a fire call. Miller and DeBartolomeo, among others, were "free-loading" at the expense of the other volunteer members. Ratajack went upstairs to the main hall of the firehouse, but, could not ignore the member's free-loading and undermining behavior. Ratajack exploded, spewing obnoxious and derogatory words and phrases about the non-participating members, including every swear word Ratajack could think of at the moment such as "f******", "niggers", "pieces of s***", "bullshit". On information and belief, none of the non-marching members heard Ratajack's tirade nor do they belong to a racial or ethnic minority. Ratajack then went downstairs to discuss ejecting the non-participating members with 2nd Assistant Chief Phillip McMurray. As the second in command, it would have been disrespectful of the chain of command to walk over McMurray and order the non-marchers to leave. Chief Ratajack, pointing at the group of non-participants, said to McMurray that it was a "bunch of bullshit" and Chief McMurray should not allow the non-marchers to remain. Instead of supporting his superior officer, 2nd Asst. Chief McMurray tried to move Chief Ratajack back into the building while challenging Ratajack's authority to act, and rebuking Ratajack for his choice of vocabulary. Their argument continued at the top of the stairs and inside the front vestibule of the firehouse and was heard by more then it should have been. Chief Ratajack again used several common swear words referring to the "free-loaders" as a group. On information and belief, none of the non-marching members heard Ratajack's tirade nor do they belong to a racial or ethnic minority. The argument ended with Chief Ratajack reminding Chief McMurray of the chain of command saying 'we needed to get on the same page or it's going to be a rough two years when I become Chief'".

This comes directly from the lawsuit lines 43-49.

I would think the 5th reason is because the streets are so tight that aerial ladders are next to impossible to get into proper position.

Captain Morris was my Captain at Ladder 28 and at Rescue 1. It was an honor and a privilege to have worked for him. As a "proby" in L28, I made a mistake at a fire and thought for sure he was going to rip me apart for it. Instead he said "do you know what you did wrong, did you learn from it, and will you never make the mistake again?". That is the essence of leadership. Last night at his "Last Tour Party", I reminded him of a conversation we had back in L-28 after he had turned down Battalion Chief for the final time and I asked him why and his response back then was "I still have 10 miles of hallways to crawl down and doors to force". Last night I asked if he had made the 10 miles of hallways and he said he came close but the clock ran out. I congratulate the Captain on his retirement and thank him for letting me serve in his companies. As a friend said to me the other day: "the man had a lot of influence on my fire department career".

Good luck to the new "Stamford Fire & Rescue Department". While there will be "growing pains" I hope everyone works together to do the right thing. I wonder what EMTBravo is going to do with all the forum space!????!

So if a bunch a people having fun at a parade is "unprofessional", can someone please tell me what a "professional" department at a parade is supposed to look like? I understand all about comraderie(spelling), brotherhood, teamwork, everyone working towards a common goal, and all the other catch phrases that get thrown around. But what does it mean to be "professional" or "unprofessional"?

Let me pose a scenario: You and your department are at your neighboring department"s parade and your tones are hit for a call in your district. Knowing that all active members are getting ready for the parade a member suggests that he and a couple other members will take the rig (brand new) and respond to the call. The member's request is denied because the rig "is being judged tonight" and it takes over 30 mins for mutual aid to get to the scene of the call. In the parade, your department wins a trophy but you find out later that what was dispatched as a "Stroke" turned out to be a "CPR" call. Question: was the department in question "professional" or "unprofessional"?

And yes, when a post is made to look at the next photo to see how "unprofessional" a department looks, that is "bashing" that department. I am sure people are going to tell me to let it go but I believe "x4093k" owes the members of the Mill Plain Vol. Fire Department an apology for "bashing" them on this forum. Just my opinion.

Really? Really? You are saying that a bunch of people having fun at a parade is "unprofessional". Are you kidding me? The real joke is that marching in a parade is even considered anything other then being fun. When departments take parades so seriously that members get reprimanded and "lose points with the judges" when they smile and wave at friends and family who are watching the parade, that is a joke. Marching in a parade and winning shiny trophies does not make you a good firefighter or a good fire department. Mill Plain is a GREAT fire department, who for years won A LOT of trophies marching in the "professional" manner and guess what? The guys are having more fun now then they did then. Keep things in perspective.

I took the Mass Civil Service Exam for Firefighter test back in the 90's. At the time of the test, you had to list 4 cities/towns you wanted your score released to. I listed Boston, Springfield, Worchester?, and Chelsea. From Boston I received notification that I was #800 on the "Veteran, non-minority, non-resident list". Needless to say I was never reached on that list. The first list was "Veteran, minority, resident", the 2nd list was "veteran, non-minority, resident", and so on. Maybe someone else can correct me, but I also believe Boston has a residency requirement for new hires that require them to live in the city while employed by the city. Chelsea MA reached me on their list and offered a conditional appointment but it never panned out.

Check with Danny "Detroit" Alfonso in FDNY E-75. He has spent a lot of time in motown and has the photos/stories to prove it!

I think that is the rig that responded to my house when we had a chimney fire the saturday morning after Christmas 1981!

I think another thing to look at is whether or not the long term event is going to be classified as a "disaster" and whether or not "disaster assistance" is going to be allocated by either private, state or federal resources. If yes, then every department that provided "mutual aid" should be compensated/reimbursed for costs incurred. Look at the FDNY's mutual aid response to the city of New Orleans after Katrina. Every FDNY member who responded was paid for his/her entire deployment (24/7 x 2)plus their shifts in NYC had to be covered details/ot. I am sure the City of New York then requested reimbursement from FEMA after all the accounting was done.

As we look at this issue and other issues concerning fire ground operations, remember the 6 "P"'s: Piss Poor Preperation Prevents Proper Performance.

A committment needs to be made that all interior firefighters should have FF1, FF Survival, FAST, OSHA/BBP,NIMS 700/100 at a minimum. And each interior firefighter needs to complete refresher training in these basic competencies each year. JMO

Yes it is and if SFRD can put at least one 4 men Engine Company in every station in Vollywood with no increase in taxes I'd seriously consider supporting it fully, unfortunately I don't see how that is possible. Under the current SFRD plan BFD is without SFRD in the house, and LR would only get 3 per station (i.e. 8 & 9) so right there that's another 24 personnel.

BFD = 4 platoons of 4 = 16 total

LR = 1 more man per station X 2 stations =2 X 4 platoons = 8 total

8+16 = 24 total

Cogs

24 is less then the "51" needed in the mayor's plan.

How (or why) can you concurrently hold both CFR and EMT certifications? That seems strange to me. Do other states allow you to hold multiple different levels of EMS certification?

And why would Massachusetts not "officially" recognize CFR in the protocols, yet continue to recognize it as a level of certification?

Now I can see why their officials had such a poor handle on certifications in light of the recent scandals.

The answer is yes to the question if you can hold both a CFR and EMT certification at the same time. In New York State I am a certified EMT-D #185331 since 1993. I am also a certified CFR-D # 185331 since 2000 when I was hired/trained by the FDNY. There have been 3 times since then when I have taken my recertification exam for CFR-D at Ft Totten in the morning and then taken my EMT recertification exam the same night in Putnam County where I live. And yes I am aware that I have the same number but each time I recertify, the state sends me a new EMT card and a new CFR card

I wonder how many of those jobs could have been saved had the city run true pupmers instead of quints for each engine company?

I believe St. Louis went to the "Quint" concept years ago in their last "manpower reduction" phase. By eliminating traditional engine companies and ladder companies, they were able to eliminate an officer and I believe 2 firefighter positions per company (and mulitply that by 4 shifts). Correct me if my memory is cloudy but the "Quint" concept was used in a bunch of places as the answer to different cities wanting to "reduce the taxpayer burdern".

I am still waiting to hear a fire chief or a mayor say that "service will be affected by these cuts" instead of the same qoute that "despite laying off 30 firefighters and losing another 24 through attrition, service will not be affected".

That brother should have been taking those window guards not the window. These guys that operate with no staffing should have someone on the inside with a rock to vent the window from the inside, that guy would have done a big help getting the line in place! How about moving that engine out of the way of the front of the building too. short building but still!

A rock? A BFR or a SFR? ( A "Big F'ing Rock" or a "Small F'ing Rock") Which pocket is that carried in? In a smoke filled room, what are your chances of actually hitting the glass? With thermalpane windows (that haligans bounce off of sometimes) how big of a rock will be needed to actually break the glass? Who carries the BFR/SFR? The nozzleman? The Officer? Are the rocks department issue or do the members have to acquire their own BFR/SFR? (At least they could write that off on taxes!) Let's assume that you are inside the fire apartment, deploy your BFR, successfully vent the window, but your BFR sails through the air striking an old lady or cop in the street. Are you and the city liable for the injuries sustained by the actions of the rapid deployment of your BFR? I wonder why FF's of yesteryear actually took time to develope the responsibilities of the outside vent position when all they had to do was throw rocks to get the job done?

Agreed, but rather then us question whether there was one in place since we cannot see what was occurring inside, we should let the investigation determine that.

Regardless of what happened with these brothers, we should remind everyone that for venting, you must communicate with the engine company and IC to request that ventilation begin. This is operational procedures taught at the lowest level of any firefighting class. At no point should a roof be cut or windows taken without a charged hose line in place and ready for water to flow. As seen here, the moment the windows were vented, the smoke when from gray, low density/wispy under no pressure to thick, black smoke under a lot of pressure, then flashed almost instantaneously.

Along those lines as well, we must also make sure that ventilation is occurring in the right place. Vertical ventilation should occur directly above the seat of the fire as possible, and horizontal should only be used in rooms involved in fire. Doing anything besides that runs the risk of pulling the heat and flames to the new vent hole and spreading the fire.

The FF on the portable appears to have vented the correct window, my question was about communication with those on the inside. As far as vertical ventilation, get it done and let me know what you did. "Nothing shall deter the roofman from completing his assigned task." For horizontal ventilation, ask/communicate before venting so that if the line is not in place/ready to go or a primary search is being done in that room/area, I can tell you to hold off on venting

I do not know what Asbury Parks SOGs are so my question is a general one: was there a charged hoseline in place, opposite of the window that the brother on the portable is venting and did he communicate with the FFs on the inside that he was taken the glass? I hope the FF who sustained burns and injuries makes a full recovery.

I congratulate the two departments on being awarded the grants. The work that goes into applying for a grant can be daunting and dedicated people have to do a lot of leg work. The problem with grants is that it is arbitrary who receives the awards but mayors, city councils, and eventually the taxpayers try to rely on grants to fund needed equipment...

If the city really wanted to make some money, they should bill for water leaks, stuck elevators (building owners), lock out/food on the stove (when it is determined there is no food on the stove), smoke detector/co detectors with bad batteries, and other non emergencies that people call 911for because they do not want to call a plumber, a lock smith, or another responsible party. Do you think the run numbers would drop then?

Hopefully the surrounding volunteer departments will "do the right thing" and not respond into the City of Newburgh. To be called once in a awhile for mutual aid is one thing, but to be used in lieu of the city meeting it's obligations to the citizens/visitors of the city is criminal. I know some people are going to think it's great to go mutual aid into Newburgh and catch some "good fire duty" but that is not what you are there for. Hopefully the volunteers will say no, especially the volunteers who are career FF's in other municipalities, and Newburgh will be forced to address their own issues.

TIP-OFF FOR AIDAN

ALL HANDS NEEDED

WHEN: SATURDAY, NOVEMBER 20, 2010 @ 6:30 P.M.

WHERE: ANCIENT ORDER of HIBERNIANS (AOH) HALL

6 LAKE AVENUE

DANBURY, CT 06810

WHY: Aidan Sullivan, the 9-year-old son of Tim (FDNY LT D-7, Brewster Vol. F.D.) and Colleen of Brewster N.Y., was born with “Hemi-facial Microsomia”. This is a birth defect that caused the right side of Aidan’s head and face to be underdeveloped at birth including missing his right ear. Over the past nine years, under the care of Dr. Joseph McCarthy at NYU Medical Center, Aidan has under gone numerous operations and surgical procedures to reshape his head and correct the underdevelopment of the right side of his face. The last surgery was performed on the back of Aidan’s throat to close his palate on the right side. On March 1, 2011, Aidan will have the first of three surgeries to construct an ear for the right side of his head. This includes taking rib cartilage out and “molding” it into the shape of an ear and then placing the “mold” under the skin where there should be an ear.

HOW: Buy a drink, tip the bartender. Buy raffle tickets for the 50/50 and other donated items. All monies raised will go towards Aidan’s expenses that include: doctor bills not covered by insurance, travel, and other expenses associated with his care, education, and therapy sessions.

CONTACT: For information or questions contact:

Pete Drake

203-648-2625 (Cell)

peter.drake@sbcglobal.net

My name is Tim Sullivan and Aidan is my son. He has endured a tremendous amount in his life and is the epitome of a "tough guy". Our friend Pete Drake, who is a Lieutenant in the Ridgefield Ct Fire Dept, has been a "guardian angel" over the years to Aidan and has organized this fundraiser. We hope some of you from around the area maybe can turn out for this event. It should be a good time. Pete has 4 seats to a Knicks basketball game ($240.00 value/each) in a silent auction but with the way the Knicks have been playing, he may have to pay the winner to go to the game! Hope to see you there.

Don't you think you are going a little overboard here? They identified the problem, tried several options in attempts to rectify the problem, and have come up with this solution. Almost every place in this area has gone through growing pains. What do you think people were saying back in the 1850's when there was talk of a paid fire department in NYC? Some were for it, some were against it. Except for preplanned cities and towns down south and out west, almost every place has gone from volunteer to some sort of combination to paid. What are the taxpayers willing to support? That is the question. Everyone can ponificate about what is best and who should be doing what but it all boils down to what are the taxpayers willing to support. All taxpayers want the lowest taxes but the highest level of service. All the taxpayer wants to see is a shiny rig show up with flashing lights when they call 911. And they don't give a hoot about anyone else's call to 911. If you ever want to witness someone having a coronary, just show them on paper whar they will have to pay for an appropriatetly staffed fire department 24/7/365.

Probably because there aren't enough volunteers to guarantee the desired level of coverage so they are adding career personnel.

I would guess that they will use standard civil service rules to fill the positions and that generally includes a test and physical exam. Are the current Long Ridge employees municipal employees or district employees? Are they civil service? That may factor into their retention.

As for there being unanswered questions, they may be unanswered by you but the City may have already addressed them. If we didn't act because of unanswered questions, we'd never advance on any issue.

If they need "paid" staff to ensure a desired level of coverage/response, they are no longer a volunteer department of "neighbors helping neighbors". There is one police department in Stamford, there is one public works department in Stamford, there should be one fire department in Stamford.