99subi

You are correct, the Rye Brook FD ff's work 7a-7p 7 days a week. They have no officers and they have no chiefs of their own. The Port Chester FD is always dispatched along with Rye Brook to all of their calls. (The Port Chester chiefs are in charge of the RBFD) They have a 2 man minumum for staffing, with I believe 4 men assigned to each (2) group. They have tried to get the Village of Rye Brook to hire more ff's so they may staff their station 24/7 without success. At 7pm 1 of the career Port Chester ff's drives his engine (59) and stays at the RBFD till the Rye Brook ff's return in the morning. Makes absolutely no sense, Rye Brook is mostly a bedroom community. Why would you want to reduce the amount of firefighters in your town during the hours when the most harm can come to the most people? Politicians can screw up anything.

On a side note they did not spend all of the money from the second stimulus bill. Those shovel ready jobs are still not ready.
The local governments have to learn how to budget themselves and set priorities. For example NYC, the mayor is spending millions of dollars on bike lanes, bike racks and city benches. They also renamed a few bridges. Then in the same news conference he is telling the city's emergency services that their budgets are going to be cut. If you ask any citizen would they rather have a teacher, FF, medic, police officer or a bike lane, bike racks , city benches. You know what the majority of the people will say. To give a local government like this federal money only makes the situation worse.

While I want to see as many PD's, FD's and schools ensure proper staffing, as I said, federal funding really isn't the way to go. As a short term solution it will accomplish strengthening those positions, but at the taxpayers expense. The same taxpayers who can't afford to have proper staffing at their local FD, will be paying for it from their other pocket, and those who will see no specific hires in their locality will pay more to strengthen other places, yet furthering their local financial burden. We don't have a national fire service or fund our local police through federal monies, so we shouldn't look to the rest of the country to solve our local issues.
I can tell you none of this comes from FOX or CNN just common sense really. Every time a they spend a dollar in DC, it cost the taxpayers $1.25 to implement (not real figures) as it takes bureaucratic offices to process taxes, grant applications, follow-up, etc. The shorter the line between the taxpayers wallet and the project being funded, the less implementation costs, the less earmarks, the less lobbyists.
As for government infrastructure projects (roads/bridges)? Hell yes they need to be done, but to call that a Jobs Bill? Who do you think pays for those projects? So we're creating jobs, at the expense of taxpayers, of course it is a smarter solution than welfare as we get something in return and those projects need to be done. But let's not call it a Jobs Bill, how about calling it the federal government spending on federally mandated projects?
I also am not convinced tax breaks for corporations or the wealthy will work, as they already get them ad look where we are. But we need to find a way to stimulate private businesses into hiring employees that we don't fund out of our taxes.

I am against the federal government bailing out local governments. Especially when the federal government is borrowing money to do so. The local governments need to learn how to balance a budget. Everyone who works for the government knows where there is a waste of resources. The economy will force the government to get rid of the waste (which includes duplication of services) and save the tax payers some money.

Due to all of the rumors regarding the test I decided to submit a FOIL request to get the facts. Here is the response I received from HR.

There haven't been any deaths/injuries or fires related to the recall. The recall is a few weeks old (VWoA sent it to dealers) and owners won't receive notices until November. VAG has been having a number of issues with the common rail diesel engine they introduced in the 2009 MY. The biggest deal is the high pressure fuel pump's tendency to destroy itself and spit metal shavings across the entire fuel system but VAG has been trying to keep that hush hush for some time.

If we observe and for the sake of this discussion only we assume the following to have been the complete and timely reporting of a structure fire for the VMFD, this is a great example to look at in more depth:
At 05:41 hours there is something burning in this basement which results in 4 engines, a truck and three commanders responding to and taking action toward @05:47 hours confirmed smoke from the basement. Two minutes later a commander transmits a 10-75 and requests TMFD FAST.
@05:58 hours we see a Rescue responding "w/FAST." A minute later a commander transmits for the FAST unit to locate at the scene, and finally @06:03 the designated FAST unit is on scene.
From 05:41 hours with an IDLH occurring at the location in the basement, twenty-two minutes later the FAST in on scene. In those 22 minutes, this fire was confirmed and obviously attacked because we have a command request at 05:55 hours for Con Ed for an electrical fire.
What I see missing from this real fire scenario, (and congratulations to the VMFD for obviously a successful stop) is a continuous, designated company from the home department that assumed and performed the necessary functions of a FAST Team. So my question would be, why is the FAST unit from the Town, 22 minutes later? What good would that have done in those critical initial attack moments when FAST is supposed to be appropriately in place as required by the OSHA Standard 1910.134 or the NFPA 1720 (volunteer standard) or NFPA 1710 (career standard applying because the TMFD is combo)?
The designated FAST company could have been engine 38, 39, 40, 41 or truck 20, and this assignment would have been continuous would it not? There should be no need for a "replacement FAST unit" 22 minutes later. I'm missing what that accomplishes regarding compliance with the Statute, but more importantly the immediate and continuous protection that should have been afforded the initial attack members who proceeded down into this burning basement.
Regardless if a commander from this job is going to possibly come back now and answer that there was a designated home company performing FAST until the arrival of the Town's Rescue, it doesn't make sense to transfer the function. Whatever home company was the initial FAST, they were the eyes from the beginning. They were locating secondary means of egress and assuring that was made available to interior units. They threw the ground ladders, stretched the FAST hoseline.
I hope the members of the VMFD will not take offense to the observations I have made here, and once again this was a real situation, but I'm not attempting to say the I.A. information is totally accurate; it's only for the sake of this discussion that I would conclude there to have been either an unnecessary delay in implementing the FAST, or an unnecessary transfer of function.
Again, I obviously wasn't there, don't know the intensity of the fire the Village faced at this job, it just so happens to be perfect timing to fit into the hypothetical for this discussion. Most sincerely am not trying to step on anyone's toes or MMQB their fire.

For example. If ABCtown gets toned for a working fire why dont they have their own FAST within their dept to roll on the first alarm? Why do they have to tone for another dept miles away that could take 20+ mins to arrive? To me this is how it should go. Tones drop. working fire. You send your first alarm assignment which should include a FAST through your dept. If you arrive on scene and need to put your fast "to work" call for another depts FAST to cover yours or go M/A for the "work". This way you always have a FAST on scene ready if god forbid they are needed.

I think the concept is being lost on some departments that create special teams for FAST when it should be the function of aany/every FF instead of "special teams" that aren't always available.
In a large career department every FF can be FAST. In smaller departments and most volunteer agencies it's treated like something special and not everyone gets the training.

Hopefully I never see him
But really, Right place, at the right time, and doing the right thing. Kudos to him!

Then give them each a tanker
My point was you might not even be good for 2 fires. If 7 of the tankers are from the West & 7 from the East, all west ones are committed, the east ones may be too far or if they are sent to cover, there wont be enough left in the east or in the west.
Yes you can what if this to death, but the departments that collectivly own 14 tankers also own 46 engine companies. It appears then that with 46 engine companies they would be able to cover more than 2 fires, but without enough water........we all know what will happen. The taxpayers have collectivly invested approximatly $21 million in these engine companies (assuming a fully equipped engine costs $450,000)and not including maintenance, insurance, fuel, housing, etc. and they would be stretch to handle more than 2 fires?
Even if we doubled the numbers, we are talking a huge area to cover and with all of those units covering 2 1/2 counties and 100's of thousands of properties, the chance of 2 or 3 fires is pretty good.

That is not true. The only reason you can not be your own is if you can't put enough players on the field.
If this were true, then why buy 3 or 4 engines when you can easily get one from a neighboring town?
If they are doing fine, whats their rating? If they are still a 9 then they have yet to prove they are doing ok. The consolidation of multi depts in one So. Caroline county resulted in standardization of tankers and improved rating
from a 9 to a 5. Tanker ops is one of many reasons.
We have 14 tankers to cover the northern 1/2 of the county. You send 7 from the NW to an incident and you have enough left for 1 incidnet, but the distances are so great that you have to strip protection from one side to cover the other, or everyone runs light and then you are just running on hope for no 2nd incident. Also when a dept only owns one tanker and relocates it, then how do they cover home?
Great reason for improving the way we do things.
This is why standardization / consolidation is so desirable.
How much safer and effective would it be if they were the same.
Not only can it happen, but NYS has been spending millions to help it along. A number of proposed legislative actions will help. What is stopping it now? Many in the local FD's are so against it that they would prefer to see no response than consolidation, so the politicians follow them for votes. If we can show those here that consolidation is good for everyone, then there is a chance for great improvements.

This is why the dual dispatch with a FASTeam was implemented. Get them started, and if you don't need them, turn em around. All of our M/A teams were more then willing to try this out.
Yorktown's own FAST team response protocol is if we cannot field a crew (minimum 4 FASTeam qualified members [which is pages long in our SOGs]) in 3 minutes and out the door in 5, we will notify 60-control and the IC we cannot field a FASTeam. If we know we cannot field it sooner then that, we'll notify them immediately. If we have the manpower(minimum 4 interior firefighters), but not a FASTeam, we will notify the IC that we can send either an engine or truck, if the IC so chooses to accept. We have a no retone policy, and honestly feel others lives are more important then our ego's
As "buffy" as this sounds, our guys are very good at "getting on the horn" the moment a neighboring department gets called to a fire, and sending out mass texts and group chats (for those who have smart phones) to see who's around to respond. We sometimes know before the first due company arrives on scene, if we'll be able to field a crew or not should we be called. Members normally start making their way to HQ to lesson the time even more as the texts are going out.
No
4 out of the first 5 arriving firemen are FASTeam members.
3 in and about 20 outside was being utilized.

Sorry Chief, I was reading up on my phone and not neglecting to respond to you. No offense taken, or feelings hurt either.
To begin, the Yorktown Heights Fire District covers approximately 40 square miles, 1/2 of which contain no hydrants. The southern end of Yorktown is the non-hydrant district, with roads that were designed for travel well before cars were ever designed to be driven on them. Old Logging Rd, which is the access road for Maiden lane is even worse. It is a single lane goat path, with barely even enough room for a single engine, let alone some massive tankers to drive up, or even turn around. OUR engines and tanker are designed to fit up these roads/ driveways, and designed with our district in mind. Some of our neighboring department's tankers will not fit down our old roads, and if they do make it down, there is no where for them to turn around to get back to a fill site. Most of the houses located on these properties are large, older buildings constructed with balloon frame, wood, plaster, lathe, and are home to many hoarders (seems to be an epidemic in Yorktown recently). The newer homes are just as big and McMansions in some cases. Many unique homes and oddly designed layouts also adorn our district on the southend.
Yorktown has 2 primary first due engines, Engine 273 out of the Commerce St station in the center of town with 1000 gallons, and Engine 272 out of Station 2 in the Northern, hydrant supplied section of town, with 750 gallons of water. The Tanker sits at the commerce st house as well. Engine 270 is a rescue pumper with only 500 gallons, and engine 271 is our spare engine (basically an older twin of 273). Engine 270 would normally be a 3rd due engine, if it responds at all, to keep our hurst tools available for a run. In our non-hydranted sections of town, it is not uncommon to have driveways that are hundreds, or even thousands of feet long (our longest being almost 1/2 a mile off of hog hill rd). Old logging road is basically no different then a common access driveway that is thousands of feet long.
Now on to your question of why 7 departments were called.
Our first due engine takes the drive way and normally lays in from the bottom for long lays. The next due engine then hooks up to that to relay pump to the first due. The tanker supplies the 2nd due, and drops its tank for a dump site there. At this particular house, the driveway was only 100' long, if that. 273 arrived first, and 272 was seconds behind them. Upon arrival, the neighbors were screaming that the owner was still inside, so our priorities immediately turned to life safety. Engine 272 immediately supplied 273 with their tank water, and sent their crew to assist in the offensive attack. Tanker 14 arrived shortly thereafter, and supplied 272.
Millwood and Croton's engines were called as draft site fills, and I believe a relay and supply line to the tanker at the scene. Even with the water that was there with the initial 3 apparatus, the water filling the supply lines, and the time it takes to back one tanker out and have another one pull in and dump its tank, the supply was running out every 2-5 minutes and we could not keep up with the fire flow formula. More tankers were requested to compensate for the lack of water supply.
Yorktown is very adamant about not stripping other towns and villages of apparatus for our fires. If we've called you for 1 piece, the only way we're going to call for something else is if there has been a discussion with the chief of that particular department a)having the capability to supply 2 pieces and the manpower and willingness to deplete their town of their own resources. If they say no, we can't/don't want to/ or unsure, they're not going to get called for 2.
Our 10-75 assignment for any non hydrant area (which we'll stick to for the remainder of the discussion [our other boxes and assignments can be found here: Yorktown box alarms]) includes tankers from 3 other departments, and an engine as a source pumper; 1 and 1 are requested on the relocate to cover our town since our manpower is focused on the working fire. FASTeams are dual dispatched on the initial report of any type of structure fire before a working fire is transmitted. 2nd alarm, moves the engine that is standing by up to a new draft site, and brings in 2 additional tankers, a cascade to the scene, another FAST and another engine on a relocate to our HQ. 3rd alarm brings in 2 additional Tankers and the Field Comm unit. The relocated ladder will not be taken off standby, as they will clog the system up.
So the 7 departments were:
Yorktown as first due
Croton - Engine and Tanker
Millwood - Engine and Tanker
Somers - Tanker, Rehab unit
Continental Village - Tanker
Katonah - Tanker
Buchannon - Cascade
Now, I'm for regonalization and standardization of some aspects of the fire department, but some areas of the county, regardless of fire district lines, are completely different then others. Apparatus design that work well in one area, may not work well in an area directly adjacent to that. Consolidation is always a hot topic, and I know prior i've been adamant about county consolidation. Honestly, I have no idea what the correct answer is. Sometimes, independant districts are fantastic, and other times they're completely horrendous. I really don't know if there is a single correct answer for the current situation around our area.
And in the utmost respectful way to ask this possible, and I really mean that, would you or anyone else for that matter, consider consolidating the ENTIRE county, large cities included, into ONE regional department? If so, why, or if you exclude large cities from your plan, why are they so special and different from a town or village department?

I don't believe that was the message of the video. The message I saw was that fire based EMS was the "best" way to go.Other than pointing out the fact that non-fire based EMS typically doesn't have the ability to provide full service care from start to finish like fire-based EMS can, how was it a disservice to them?
You are correct that putting the patient first and providing excellent care matters most. However, in many situations providing excellent care means that you have to take the care to the patient and doing that requires more than just showing up with an ambulance and some medical equipment. Typically, non-fire based EMS is not trained and equipped to provide care at the point of contact in all "rescue" situations. This inability could translate into providing the patient less than "excellent" care overall.

I can only imagine how many non-residents will sign up for this.

I wish EVERY town would do this!

3 years. good lord. Imagine if they had to remake the ketchup bottles.

Same thing they were thinking when they merged the Sheriff's office, and the Fire Department.

Why would you want it removed, wouldnt you want to be aware of things that go on? Its a learning experince.

But those are not emergency situations. I think that the whole apparatus roof and hosebed are a dangerous place to wash rigs, pack hose, etc. I've never seen this issue addressed before.
Just putting out the fire on the roof is an issue itself. But these wires often come off a spool. If broken, they tend to snap back. Gosh forbid this wire snapped, which with the fire it has potential to do, it would have knocked that Chief right off that roof. If Con Ed was on scene with a bucket truck, or an Aerial on scene, it would provide a much better and secure platform. Plus, putting yourself underneath the wires and near the poles is like operating in the "collapse zone"
As far as the PPE goes, if he's not wearing a nomex station pants and a nomex shirt, then he has no basic PPE that's going to help him, such as if a spark hits him.
And the apparatus operator....he has to operate under the direction of the Chief, or face insubordination charges.

The only thing I can make of this post is your either friends with the subject of the photo, in the department, or both. Either way why can't we agree at the very least in hindsight it was a bad idea. You know what this website is becoming notorious for? People to the end defending some real bad tactics. We have a number of people sticking by using hyraulic spreaders to lift a car in another thread even after some of us have shared our experinces where things didn't work or are too dangerous to be used as a tactic. It's never good to be in the spotlight like this but it ocassionally happens to even the best out there the difference is they realize their mistakes and don't let them happen again. A previous post just aluded to it and I'll bet there are some officers on here that won't allow this to happen if they are in the same situation now that they have reviewed this. That's the reason that the secret list posts this stuff.

So because this person is a friend of yours, we can't talk about a big operational error that he made? So that means if my friend isn't wearing his gear right, or not wearing it at all, I should just overlook it because friendship comes before safety?

Why would you want it removed, wouldnt you want to be aware of things that go on? Its a learning experince.

Why would you want it removed, wouldnt you want to be aware of things that go on? Its a learning experince.