16fire5

I was at a car fire where this happened and it was just bad timing. It let go as we walked up to it. One guy actually put his haligan under the tire as it slowly rolled and it almost stopped it. The car ended up rolling into the engine. As much as a lot of people in these fourms have stated SOPs were violated it is rare I see a car fire extinguishment I like. Do you chock the wheels off the bat every car fire you go to? Sometimes depending on involvement it may difficult to appproach. Use it as a learning tool. Vehicle fires are no win events. The property is already lost on arrival 99% of the time and there are a multitude of thing that can really hurt people.

The bigger problem was the "chain". I have often been the accoutability officer (not an official title on our job, but default by running the CP). On a working fire we would collect each rigs ring (7 or 8 rigs + staff). Each ring has 3-4 tags....thats approximatly 30 tags that are all channed together. They would hang from the command board down to the ground. On the few occassions when we needed to figure out who was where or had to remove a tag (like when a member is transported by EMS off the scene), it was a major production to sort thru that mess to find them. I never had to search under the pressure of a missing member or mayday and at that time I would have other responsabilities on top of that.

This is why I feel the Passport system is superior to tags. The printout is good but the problem is having it up to date. Shift change and middle of the tour medical leaves cause changes. This is one advantage of EFAS since it constantly is aware of what is being imputed but still the officer must keep their electronic riding list updated.

Queens did a pilot with chips in bunker coats that automaticly propagated an electronic riding list. I have no idea how this worked out but it would be one way to deal with the multitude of problems caused by shift change.

Oh Lord, why's an Engine Captain teaching vent ops? He won't be able to do that from a Florida beach (soon)........More War stories to tell @ The Villages Senior Complex in Fla.

Ed:

Word on the street is you can't walk 5 feet at "The Villages" without hearing fire stories.

I used to argue (usually unsuccessfully) that the Safety Officer wasn't the accountability person but needed to know that everyone was accounted for. The Safety Officer has many more responsibilities than collecting tags. There should be someone assigned to just that reporting back to the ICP - where the IC and Safety Officer should both be - that everyone is or isn't accounted for.

That was my whole point. You could actually teach anyone to be the accountability officer and as a matter of fact we use Lieutenants and Fire Alarm Dispatchers from the Field Comm to do it and we only let Battalion Chiefs serve as the Safety Officer(ABCs can not). The safety officer on the other hand is someone you really want to trust. For instance he would be the guy to do a 360 and tell you the it's time to pull the plug.

As a follow-up to my above post, and to reinforce what Capt. Nechis said,

My department just recently had a fire, and I had this thread floating somewhere in the back of my head. I saw our safety officer on scene( traffic vest with "Safety Officer" on the back) standing inside the house, and I handed my tag to him. His answer was, "Oh, well I haven't started collecting these yet". Long story short, I told him to keep it for when he does get around to being the safety officer.

At the end of the fire, I never got my tag back. I doubt I will ever see it again.

Real useful system....

Is the safety officer really fulfilling the function of safety officer if they do accountability? They are probably just doing accountability then and not safety. I know that is what most volunteer fire departments use their safety officer for but if he really is a comptetent experienced guy you could use him more wisely.

I'm supprised no one in our area the passport system. I had a chance to witness it in use and I believe it is much better than tags. For one when you are attempting to do a roll call because of something like a collapse or rapid evac you can look down and see the names instad of fumbling through tags. The biggest part of accountability system is the part tags never replace and thats the levels of personal accountability responsibilities. Firefighters need their officer to know where they are, officers need their sector or IC to know where they are. If you have SOPs like we do in NYC the IC knows where you are based on your assignment but if for some reason you are deviating you need to use your radio. Accountability systems that work well are parts of a larger system that has good SOPS, communications, and ICS.

The EFAS and systems like it are great but even they will no work if there is no command and control.

Very well said Barry.

There is way too much fear of consolidation in the fire service in our area and on this board. Most of the members who come one here are really into the job. What they should realize is a consolidate fire service in Westchester would probably mean better training, more activity, more job opportunities, safer operations, and better service to the public.

We would have less chiefs with facial hair, less deadwood, less unqualified personnel, less apparatus.

If I was young and growing up in the fire service in Westchester I'd be all for the first option.

Note: if they know what they are doing, the head of the fork has been squared off, the the smart ff, just slide the axe down the shaft to strike the head.

Pretty hard to do with all that tape on the shaft.

Personally I'm out on the tape on the irons. Great on the hook though.

Try a mongoose.

Since I really can't stand snakes I have found out that you can't import the mongoose. They basically kill all the small native species. But if you live in India they can be domesticated and are immune to cobra venom. Who could forget Rikki-Tikki-Tavi

and the city of st. denis in france even named a friggen street after him - a street named in honor of a cop killer - UNREAL.

Had to look it up when I read this part. They actually refer to this POS as a Political Prisoner. Made me sick to my stomach.

My personal favorite is how many tickets you get that say fire in a Private Dwelling Apt. 13D 13 Floor. Which I figure is because the caller who lives in public housing referes to their abode as their house. Our Fire Alarm Dispatchers would filter this information for us and give us a ticket that makes sense.

RIP Brother.

RIP. Condolences to the Mt. Vernon Fire Department.

Capt.,

I've said it before you add a tremendous amount to this forum with you knowledge. Particularly your understanding of the intricacies of ISO and the regulations that affect the fire service. That combined with the practical advice on how fire departments big and small can comply/operate has undoubtedly assisted readers of this forum with making their departments better.

Mohegan Fire has 2 of them....there are NO MID-MOUNTS in the area. seems like a good idea for one to make it to the tri-village.

Honestly based on the size of buildings, the call volume, and the population I think the tri-village would be just fine with one truck.

very interesting comments, NOW STOP WANTING US TO PAY INTO OUR PENSION, BACK UP AND STAY THE HELL AWAY FROM OUR MONEY YOU WHITE COLLAR GREEDY THIEVES.

We pay in already and I believe your new tier will pay in. Absent a Constitutional Convention and change your terms are set.

Dangerous fires. Glad to hear no one was hurt.

Date: 12/03/2011

Time: ~1400

Location: 303 County Route 50

Frequency:

Units Operating: New Hampton, 2nd Alarm Pocatello tanker, Mechanicstown tanker & truck, Goshen Tanker & Truck, Slilver Lake Fast, Slate Hill Tanker & Engine, Johnson Tanker, Echo Lake Fill Site Middletown Engine, Mobile Life Support

Standbys

Greenville 1 Tanker standby New Hampton

Howels 1 Engine Standby New Hampton

Weather Conditions:

Description Of Incident: 2nd Alarm Structure Fire

Reporters:

Writer:

14:18 Per New Hampton Command fire knocked down most of the mutual aid released.

*Moderator Note - Your IA Title Was Corrected, Please Post With Appropriate Title From Now On

Someone can confirm this for me but I was talking to some troopers probably 15 year ago and at the time most of the state operated as a 20 hour road patrol. Meaning they had 2 10 hour shifts. 4 hours in the middle of the night were handled by calling members in from home. Since they all take their cars home. I knew they were planning on changing even back then but it was really unfathomable for someone from the NY metro area.

My job issues me a Ben 2 which I wear and like. I like the long chin strap that allows me to don my facepiece through it. What I like about the Cairns helmets is the defender visor. I will admit I have never worn it but the concept is great. The visor stays protected from scratches and soot so it is actually there when you need it. They actually change our bourkes for us but it's useless they get black in a few months. You can even get the Cairns with the defender and the bourkes so you can have the look and the function.

Yes

100 hours minimum for career

8 hours minimum for volunteers

And this is the main reason for the volunteer vs. career debates that crop up here.

Note: Before this turns into another war, we all know those numbers are minimums and many firefighters have much more than that.

Would you agree that you really can't meet the requirements when you include the Hazmat, BBP, Violence Prevention in 8 hours. I think department's should spend more time making this training realistic and worthwile as opposed to getting it done in 8 hours. Also that is the bare minimum if you do other basic services such as auto extrication, and ice rescue they need be trained on.

At 15 years old, I peered out the limosine window at the saluting line of Firefighters. The vision is still fresh in my mind.

I have been told that by more than one firefighter who as a kid was unfortunate enough to take that limo ride. I remind my self that when my slight discomfort from standing at attention or the weather pales in comparison to the discomfort felt by those riding in the limo.

I know quite a few guys who use this setup. I don't know of any issues. I'm not a knife fan myself. I think in a blind situation it is very difficult to cut the entanglement with a knife. I personaly go with cable cutters. My advice is recreate the situation you envision you need knife for and see if you can do it in zero visibility. Also make sure you have all your gear on they way you would on the fire floor. This way you can see where you want things in your pockets. My advice in a pocket on the side of your dominant hand possibly with a teather attached.

Ok so I just went to VES and there is a story about my type of set up here.

http://www.vententersearch.com/?p=1499

I didn't off an opinion about your staffing. I know nothing about the City of NR except for its call volume. I do know that its FF on shift per call is higher than just about every city in this area (excluding FDNY). However, that's a simple calculation that doesn't account for timing of the calls, type of calls, time on task per call, resources needed per call, etc. The number of "employed" firefighters also doesn't account for those who are "employed" but out on some type of injury.

Also, I might make a suggestion that you proofread your posts. Your last sentence is not only a run-on sentence, it's a fragment that makes little to no sense.

City of New Rochelle is a City of 72,000. Your comparisons are apples to oranges or oranges to grapes. New Rochelle has true commercial high rises and a large daily influx of workers that the other cities I assume you are comparing to does not. I'm guessing the 72,000 is low ball anyway and definatly does not include the college students.

As I read it in NYS an entity can only purchase fuel exempt from the excise tax for its' "own" use. I'm pretty sure dispensing it into POVs even if a tiny bit would be used for "official" purposes is not legal.