AFS1970

I will say that Brotherhood in the overall larger sense seems to be a little more intact. In this I mean that everyone shows outside firefighters the utmost respect, goes out of their way to show them things, advise them on where to eat or stay and otherwise recognize that we're all members of something different than the normal job. Is this truly Brotherhood or just a small piece therein? I say the latter. When you start to network with other fire service personnel from all over you can see that there is a little more to this than just having the same job in a different town. There are still many of us to call all other firefighters brother or sister and would be happy to invite them in to share a meal or go have a beer and share thoughts, ideas and stories about the job.
In a positive manner as you first asked, last week it was relayed to me that on another shift a Brother from away stopped in and was in the area for a funeral of a close family member, they were hosting a large contingent of family for the weekend and was looking for a place to get a horseshoe pit set up. One of our guys quickly gave up a set he had at home, sending them to his garage to retrieve what was need for as long as it was needed. Not a big deal, but at least a glimmer that someone had the idea to just help a Brother out, instead of sending to Walmart by the quickest route.
As I typed these two posts I noticed that I'd twice mis-typed Brotherhood as botherhood, maybe it was a sign of my dismay. I won't give up, and I hope many others won't either, we just have to find away to show the value in making the fire service more than just a job.

I think Firemoose827 it's because of the World we now live in where like many have said you can't offend anyone anymore and have to constantly be "politically correct" for fear of being sued and labeled a racist. Tradition in the F/S is practically dead which is sad. Like one member posted in the other forum also, everyone now receives a trophy and as a result can not accept failure and to be told their no good at something and if they are will head right to the powers to be to complain. This all trickles down to the moral on the job where nobody wants to participate in anything anymore. Another big reason why I see the Brotherhood disappearing is because of the quality of individuals Depts. are hiring. Depts. now seem to be more concerned with "Quantity" then "Quality" for fear again of being labeled racist/biased towards certain individuals and groups and have lowered their "STANDARDS" to attract these individuals. As a result those members who are 100% dedicated towards their Profession get discouraged having to work with these incompetent individuals who for the most part are just there for a paycheck and don't want to associate with them either on or off the Job, especially when these individuals don't get reprimanded for their unacceptable actions/mistakes on and off the Job but almost seem to be rewarded and left alone. After awhile it gets discouraging to those who really do care and try and do the" right" thing and as a result everyone is out for themselves and the "Brotherhood" is now in the toilet. JMO

Why should EMS be concerned about billing getting the face sheet done. Your job should end at the patient hand off and not be concerned with the billing. Believe me they will find a way to bill for that $40 asprin with out you calling in initials and DOB.

Date: 08/18/2013
Time:22:29
Location: 143 Hoyt St (Buckingham Buildings)
Units: E1,T1,E5,E3,R1,E4 (RIT),U4 (IC),E6.T3 (2nd Alarm),M1, M901 (EMS Command),FM112 (C&O)

Description: Initially reported via 9-1-1 to State Police as a car fire in the basement garage of a high rise condo building. Simultaneous to dispatch this was reported by a central station as an activated alarm. Initial dispatch of an Engine and Truck for the car fire was sent. At 22:31, units arriving on scene reported smoke condition in basement, at 22:38 upgrade to full box and stretching a handline into garage. Upgrade brought an aditional 2 engines, Rescue, Deputy Chief and a RIT (another Engine). Updated size up reported fire extinguished by sprinklers, Fire Marshal requested. Units assigned to primary search of residential units above fire. At 22:50 IC requested an additional Truck, followed by an additional Engine (Equivilent of a 2nd Alarm*). Further Update from IC at 23:08 was All Hands Working on smoke removal (Including reassigned RIT) with no aditional RIT needed. Units begining tp be released as able at 23:15.

Date: 08/18/2013
Time:0538 hrs
Location: 23 Pettom Rd
Units:C2,E2,T2,E1,T1,R1,E5(RIT).E3 and E4 added after arrival of initial alarm units. New Canaan,Rowayton and Westport FDs called for coverage. NEMS and several M/A EMS called
Description: Report of a house fire with people trapped. Upon arrival C2 found a 1-1/2 story Cape with heavy fire showing at A/D corner (garage), heavy smoke throughout structure. Two occupants had jumped out of windows and suffered minor burns and smoke inhalation. FD forced front door and found 3rd party behind the door with burns over approx 90% of his body.He was removed and turned over to EMS. Heavy smoke and high heat throughout structure. Quick knockdown by engine companies. During initial attack, truck and rescue companies found 4th victim in upstairs bedroom unconscious,unresponsive and with extensive burns. Victim removed with CPR in progress and turned over to EMS. Investigation being done by NFD Fire Marshal's Division and CT State Fire Marshals.

Quite a few years ago our city put in a very draconian sexual harassment policy. We were told that failing to sign it would result in immediate termination. Our union advised us all to add the words "signed under duress" above our signatures. To the best of my knowledge nothing else was ever done about the fact that this threat bypassed the normal chain of discipline. I think the union knew that this was a hot button issue and any attempt to alter the policy would fail n the court of public opinion. I only know of two complaints filed under that, one was found to be false and the other was thrown out because of the insane nature of the complaint (it also mentioned that the harassment involved the past lives of both parties).
Back when I was a volunteer officer, there was a brief push to write a code of conduct that would address this. The chief wanted to hire a lawyer to write it. I asked to do it and have the lawyer look it over. My version (as far as I know) is still a draft that was never adopted. This was mostly because the members the chief was looking to harass with charges of breach of conduct all left the department so he didn't see the vital need for the document any more. A few years later another officer tried writing a sexual harassment SOP, he was assisted in this by his girlfriend / subordinate (as opposed to his wife at the time) so you can see where the frame of reference was going on that one. However she was taking much from the corporate world which had some truly bizarre regulations. Mine had come largely from college athletic programs because they recognized that close physical contact might be part of the activity and not harassing in any way.
To the best of my knowledge, my former volunteer department still has no policy despite a couple of high profile incidents. Lately at work there is some new form that acknowledges the long policy from before that we all have to sign. This time the union seems silent on it, offering no advice about how to sign it.
The end result is you have people who are too afraid to talk with each other look at each other or even engage in friendly banter because something might be taken the wrong way. In my opinion this actually makes for a more hostile work environment as it erodes the camaraderie that has been a hallmark of the emergency services forever.

The first one is not a call, but related to the 9/11 experiences being shared by some. I was not able to make it to the city that day, we were mobilizing a task force of fire and ems from my county to respond on the NYS mutual aid response system but were cancelled last minute due to all the career and volunteer firefighters that just showed up without notice. SO instead of turning them around they put them to work and had us stand-by.
But a week later, a local church had a memorial service for those lost that day and invited all of the FD's, EMS and Police agencies to attend. We were car pooling to the event and there were 7 of us in uniform standing in the open truck bay or our station waiting for more members to show. Across the street from us a couple emerged from their car slowly, and the woman had been crying, she looked at us and started to cry hysterically again. Her husband held her and they walked across the street as if in a funeral procession. They got to us and they both were crying at this point. She finaly told us (through her tears) that they wanted to thank us for helping strangers and doing what we did. That was all they said. They then hugged every one of us, a long hug, saying nothing else to us. Then they turned and walked a few feet away, and turned back and told us "God bless all of you and your families, I will never forget any of you again..." and they went back to their car....None of us talked, we just sat there dumbfounded until we finaly got up and piled into two cars and went to the ceremony, a little more somber then we were already, and the chief and 2 of us were even tearing up a bit.
One is more funny then serious; I went to a structure fire in my past department with my father. We arrived on scene in the first due engine to find it fully involved on the first and second floors with smoke pumping from the basement doors. I remember stretching a 2 1/2" line and was getting ready for water when i heard barking from the basement. I yelled to my father and the Lieutenant on scene to grab a tool and ran over to the door, it was locked on the inside. My father had a halligan and told me to cover him with the line. He forced the door open and quicker then either of us could react 5 dogs of various size raced out and ALL latched on to my fathers bunker pant leg, snarling and growling. I froze and didnt know what to do first when my father started Screaming "SHOOT THEM!!! SHOOT THE LITTLE BASTARDS!!!" while he tried to kick at them with his other leg. It was hysterical to watch as the Lt quickly fell to the ground laughing and wailing. I shot them with a quick blast from the line and they all took off into the woods behind the home. Hey...they were alive. We kept an eye out for them the rest of the time there and the owners tried calling to them but I guess they were afraid of their rescuers! They finally emerged from the woods during overhaul and the owners got them in the car ok and took them to the vet. No injuries for the dogs, but my fathers leg and pride...another story!!
My second call as an EMT-CC; It was on the Interstate during a freak ice storm that came out of nowhere. A pickup going 65 lost control on the ice, spun around 360 degrees 2 or 3 times and then slammed head-on into a tractor-trailer behind him that also lost control going 70...driver of the pickup was ejected and rolled 45 yards down the road, his truck looked like an accordian. Driver of the rig was pinned, both legs busted, ribs busted, head injury. I got out of the bus and ran to the guy that was ejected with the trauma bag and he took his last gurgling breath as I knelt next to him with the county paramedic (that just taught my class) with me. We tubed him, the medic did needle chest decompressions, started 3 large bores on him and packaged him up. He ended up flying out in the bird that was called for the rig driver but he was still pinned and being extricated by 2 FD's. 37 minutes later we got the driver out and flew him out on bird #2 that both landed right on the interstate. Both are alive and well today, a little handicapped but still breathing.
Last call to talk about but many more come to mind, its been 24 years...
I went to a house fire, 3rd department called for tanker and manpower. By the time we got there the main fire was knocked, so they had us check for extension. I was walking through the living room joking around with a guy I trained with from another department and I was just taking pictures and stuff off the wall and wrapping them in a blanket from the back of the couch. I grabbed a couple of dozen picture frames from the walls, I couldnt see what they were due to the soot. I took other items off shelves and tucked them in the couch cushions and did other salvage work too. We finished our sweep and came outside (with the blanket wrapped picture frames over my shoulder like santa) and I scanned the front yard for the owners. They were across the street with the neighbors on the lawn so I approached them. I gave them the blanket and told them I grabbed some things for them and protected a bunch of other stuff, and told them where I put it all. The wife looked at some of the frames and started to cry...hysterically...I didnt know if I should hug her or run and hide...then she looked at me and said "These are my wedding pictures of my grandparents, theyr'e very old, and these are my daughters graduation pictures, and this...(holding up a frame)...is my daughters birth certificate with hand and foot prints..." She hugged me and cried. The hubby shook my hand and said thank you about 2 dozen times. THAT, was the best call ever, even though the house was a loss, but their memories were saved. Almost as good as saving a life I guess.

You're right. For those involved in the WTC, nothing will ever compare to that. In fact nothing will ever compare to that day. The plane crash in Shanksville, Pa. The Pentagon. All air traffic shut down. People fleeing Manhattan. People helping people. Hospitals as far away as New Haven, Ct preparing for injuried to be brought in on trains.
That beautiful day became Americas darkest cloud. September 11, 2001 will never be forgotten. Over 3,000 innocent people were murdered that day in a few short hours. Many have passed on from the effects of that day. Many are still suffering with breathing and sinus problems.
How can anything else compare ?

On the EMS side....
While working for Abbey Richmond in White Plains on a Sunday morning back in the early 1980's. I was assigned as the paramedic on the transport ambulance and was told to return to the office. My EMT and I were told to go do a 2 man ambulette from Longview Nursing Home in W.P. to Grace Church on Main St in W.P.
We were told that there were no ambulette drivers working and the transport had to be done. When we arrived ( in an ambulette ) we found a 106 y.o. female named Clara Beech. She was allowed to leave the nursing home only once a year on her birthday, and for medical services. Clara was as alert as a 40 y.o. and could see as good as anyone thru her coke bottle thick glasses. She was packaged and wheeled out to the ambulette. As we got outside she broke out in a song of praise for the beautiful day the Lord gave her on her birthday. Now off to Grace Church we went. When we arrived you would had thought the Pope was coming to the church. The church was mobbed. We wheeled her into church all the way to the front where she was the center of attention, which she ate up.
We left her there and returned 2 hours later to take her back to the nursing home. To see the joy on this woman's face more then made up for the fact that an A.L.S. bus was taken out of service for an ambulette call.
Well if you think it ends here it only half over.
Fast forward 1 year. I was again working Abbey W.P. this time on Amb-1. When I reported for work I checked the transport booking slips for the day. Right on top was the slip for Clara to go to church for her 107th birthday. Again it would take the transport A.L.S. ambulance out of service. I told the Transport medic that I'd do the ambullete call and he cover the city. He thought I was nuts but he agreed.
When we walked into her room at the nursing home ( which was only about a 10 bed nursing home) she looked up saw me and greeted me by my first name. She then said "so you came back to take me to church on my 107th birthday". I could believe she remembered me.
Off to church we went again and there was another mob at the church for Clara's birthday.
When we picked her up for the return she asked if we could drive around a bit. We drove around W.P. for about 30 minutes as she gave us a guided tour of how W.P. use to be around the turn of the century. That's the 1800's into the 1900"s. She grew up in W.P.
I don't know what ever happened to Clara, but I think about those two birthday ambulette trips to church often.

Also, I thought there was research out their that said CISD, or at least mandatory CISD ended up doing more harm than good?
I know several people wrote into JEMS after they did a pro-CISD article bringing this fact up
EDIT: As far as the ADHD comment was concerned, I know of at least one specific case where someone was on medication for ADHD, didn't disclose it, and went on to serve honorably in the US Army ABN during Operation Iraqi Freedom/Operation Enduring Freedom. Had they disclosed the fact they were on medication as an elementary school child, they would have been kept out of the Army.
I just don't think it is right, that one has a better chance of being hired with criminal arrests (that were plea-bargained to violations) as a teenager or young adult, then with having seen a psych doctor as a small child

1) my neighbor needs help putting out the garbage and mowing thelawn andthere are many others just like them.
2) I agree with you about the "Label" of firefighter. I have a big problem with a dept claiming to the public it has 100 FIREFIGHTERS, when we start counting and find 20 have retired to Fl. but still make the annual dinner, another 10 are in "skilled nursing facilities" and 40 of them are exterior only ("Support Personnel") That means you only have 30 "Firefighters" and 25 of them work out of the area.
I do not mind if a VFD is honest to itself and the public. But Isee deptslike the one above claiming to the public that they are protecting them...Its great to help your neighbors, if you are actually helping them.

I just wanted to clarify my position here, I wrote this in the FAST topic and quickly saw how many of you could get confused and call me out on this issue, so allow me to clarify;
I believe there can be two forms of membership in the volunteer service; Firefighters, and "Support Personnel". The firefighters need that standard of training for the whole state, to be on the same page as other firefighters and I believe that we should have to get licensed like EMT's and Paramedics have to, so we have to re-certify every 5 years to keep up to date on old and new skills and demonstrate to an official person that we can still PERFORM those skills AND have the knowledge needed to stay alive, that we didnt forget it or that we actually PAYED ATTENTION during classes. Around here I see it too much; young guys go take every class, YET they are in the back row, no note books or pens, joking around with "buddies", not paying attention and there is NO TEST. At the end you go up and get your pretty piece of cardboard with you name on it and some fancy signatures from the fire administrator and fire coordinator (that means absolutely NOTHING without the "Passed Exam" in the upper corner) and go back to your station and start to brag about it...
I feel that by having to pass both a written exam and practical exam, supervised by state officials from the fire service, in order to receive a "Firefighter I" License (Like a NYS EMT Card but for Firefighter I, II, III, Fire Officer I, II,III, and Haz-Mat Tech I, II, III) it would force these younger guys to pay attention and actually learn, and by re-certifying every five years its not just a get the certificate and throw it out and forget it type thing anymore, you need to stay on top of things, read articles, attend other classes so you can pass the re-cert tests. Thats what the volunteer fire service needs.
As far as "Support Personnel", they can be like the old "Fire Patrol" units. They can support exterior ops like hose lays, drafting, ladder positioning, rehab areas, staging areas and then later assist with salvage operations and re-packing the hose and cleaning tools so the exhausted firefighters can take time to re-charge. Or like I mentioned in my quote, assist with shelters and other support functions like fund raisers and fire prevention activities.

NFPA 1001 is the industry standard. Period. That's the legal standard you're going to be held to in court when something happens.
Objective certification testing would eliminate the ability of departments to "fake it."
If NYS can pass a gun control law against the wishes of almost every elected Sheriff in the state, I don't see why they can't pass a law setting NFPA Firefighter 1 as the minimum standard for all Firefighters against the wishes of every elected Fire Chief.

While I agree whole heartedly about this topic I feel it's just as important to have some degree of high standards to be able to even join a Dept. whether it be Career or Volunteer. Do we really need to be working next to a highly trained criminal? It's time to raise the Bar and not turn the Fire Service into a handout Job. Better Sceening and an Interview process is just as important! JMO.

Yes
Anyone with the title of firefighter should have like training.
I am fire police with my department and I will not identify myself as a firefighter because I have no training as such. I think the same should go for others who don't engage in firefighting activities.

1) "Mutual" Aid does mean you help me and I help you. If you need a million $$$ ladder everytime you have a call and you cant send one to me when I need it, its no longer mutual, its just your cheap taxpayers leaching of mine.
2) ISO requires every response to have a ladder or service company (based on building size and fire flow requirement). If you do not have one your rating goes up. Depending on what their rating is, it could cost millions per year in increased insurance premiums to not have a ladder.

That was the general point I was trying to make about it, although ICS was just an example.

A seasoned cop will stay upwind. A seasoned FF or EMT will remained staged until the PD advises differently, even if they see a pt being loaded into a bus. I'm not getting payed to smell like smoke for the next month or become another rescue in a fire. And the FF/EMT isn't getting payed a stipend per pt. (maybe some are for all I know) As a FF/EMT if you are told to stage in a safe location until the PD renders it safe, what's the big deal-it's for a reason. If you choose to enter that location for an EDP perhaps and you wind up getting hurt or even worse, hurting someone. You may wind up having much answering to do. Either criminal or civil. I know way too many guys that wished they would have followed protocol or used their head. I hate to say it, but its us verse them/it, not each other. stay safe

All scenes? How about many or most.
In my 1st 15 years our PD was never sent on EMS calls at nursing homes. Then all of a sudden they were being sent to everyone. I asked why (they do not provide any pt care) and was told they were needed to determine if a crime had been committed (pt with a fever).
I asked why they were not arresting people, because its a crime to treat people the way they are treated in some "skilled nursing facilities"?
Often they do not arrive until after EMS has transported, they just get the info or meet the ambulance at the ER. These extra couple thousand calls are showing "productivity"

From the dispatch persepective I have always wondered why we send agencies to other agencie's calls. In my dispatch center a call for a structure fire automatically goes to both the police and fire dispatchers. By the very nature of police being out on patrol and fire waiting in a station for a call, it is almost impossible for the police to not arrive first. I often ask this question, why are we sending the police. Most often I get the nebulous answer that they might be needed. By this theory we should send police, fire and EMS on all calls because they might be needed. Do we send EMS on all buglaries because someone might have cut themselves on a broken window? I have been criticized for not sending the dive team to a car partially in the water with the driver standing looking at it, based on the idea that there might have been a body in the trunk. If that were really a concern then fire should be responding to all abandoned cars for the same reason.
Now there are concerns that the police need to deal with at many fire scenes, but none are critical enough that we need to send them well before we have alerted the fire department. THe old joke about the first car having to get there in time to block the hydrant is only sometimes a joke, but I was on a call once where one of our guys had to get out of the tower ladder and move the unattended police car at the end of the block, because the officer parked it across the street then walked up to look at the fire. I get that there are sometimes traffic concerns and there are even times when fires become crime scenes, but I also think that we are sometimes putting our responders in a no win situation by sending them unequiped for the situation.
The example of the police officer on scene when a civilian brigns out a victim needing CPR is one thing. But the public expects all responders to just do something. They do not understand why that police officer is not running in and trying to rescue all those people. This has lead to a culture where we have trained police officers to disregard their own safety. Why do firefighters wear turnout gear? Because years of science have told us it is the best way not to get burned. Why do police run into burning buildings? Because the fire department was not there yet. To this I will ask why were the police there? As a dispatcher I can wait a few seconds for the fire department to be alerted before sending the police to a call where their main function will be support, especially in a world where most fire responses are under 5 minutes.

There are absolutely things for each service to do at many scenes. I think it is not just adreneline that causes the potential to become victims but the genuine desire to do something helpful. This is exactly why most of us went into these fields. nobody wants to feel useless or for that matter to appear useless. This is by no means a bad thing, but it works against us. I am not saying never to send the police to a fire call, but I am not sure why it seems like a raceto see who can dispatch their units first, when the clear priority is getting the fire department going and in place quickly and efficiently.
This works for other services also. I once dispatched an EDP call in a district that the FD goes on all medicals. So this call got PD, FD & EMS. I told FD & EMS to stage a block away and wait until the police cleared the scene. After a while the Captain on the engine gets on the air and asks if he can clear up, when I told him I would see if PD needed them, he said he could see them loading the EDP into the ambulance from his staging point. EMS didn't feel the need to stage. I notified the EMS supervisor about this and was told it was not my job to tell them to stage, his guys knew how to watch out for their own safety. Funny how things change, now if I don't tell them to stage they ask for a staging location on the air.
The goal always has been and always will be that everyone goes home in one piece.

we all take calculated risks-only sometimes adrenaline causes us to miscalculate...

From the dispatch persepective I have always wondered why we send agencies to other agencie's calls. In my dispatch center a call for a structure fire automatically goes to both the police and fire dispatchers. By the very nature of police being out on patrol and fire waiting in a station for a call, it is almost impossible for the police to not arrive first. I often ask this question, why are we sending the police. Most often I get the nebulous answer that they might be needed. By this theory we should send police, fire and EMS on all calls because they might be needed. Do we send EMS on all buglaries because someone might have cut themselves on a broken window? I have been criticized for not sending the dive team to a car partially in the water with the driver standing looking at it, based on the idea that there might have been a body in the trunk. If that were really a concern then fire should be responding to all abandoned cars for the same reason.
Now there are concerns that the police need to deal with at many fire scenes, but none are critical enough that we need to send them well before we have alerted the fire department. THe old joke about the first car having to get there in time to block the hydrant is only sometimes a joke, but I was on a call once where one of our guys had to get out of the tower ladder and move the unattended police car at the end of the block, because the officer parked it across the street then walked up to look at the fire. I get that there are sometimes traffic concerns and there are even times when fires become crime scenes, but I also think that we are sometimes putting our responders in a no win situation by sending them unequiped for the situation.
The example of the police officer on scene when a civilian brigns out a victim needing CPR is one thing. But the public expects all responders to just do something. They do not understand why that police officer is not running in and trying to rescue all those people. This has lead to a culture where we have trained police officers to disregard their own safety. Why do firefighters wear turnout gear? Because years of science have told us it is the best way not to get burned. Why do police run into burning buildings? Because the fire department was not there yet. To this I will ask why were the police there? As a dispatcher I can wait a few seconds for the fire department to be alerted before sending the police to a call where their main function will be support, especially in a world where most fire responses are under 5 minutes.

From the dispatch persepective I have always wondered why we send agencies to other agencie's calls. In my dispatch center a call for a structure fire automatically goes to both the police and fire dispatchers. By the very nature of police being out on patrol and fire waiting in a station for a call, it is almost impossible for the police to not arrive first. I often ask this question, why are we sending the police. Most often I get the nebulous answer that they might be needed. By this theory we should send police, fire and EMS on all calls because they might be needed. Do we send EMS on all buglaries because someone might have cut themselves on a broken window? I have been criticized for not sending the dive team to a car partially in the water with the driver standing looking at it, based on the idea that there might have been a body in the trunk. If that were really a concern then fire should be responding to all abandoned cars for the same reason.
Now there are concerns that the police need to deal with at many fire scenes, but none are critical enough that we need to send them well before we have alerted the fire department. THe old joke about the first car having to get there in time to block the hydrant is only sometimes a joke, but I was on a call once where one of our guys had to get out of the tower ladder and move the unattended police car at the end of the block, because the officer parked it across the street then walked up to look at the fire. I get that there are sometimes traffic concerns and there are even times when fires become crime scenes, but I also think that we are sometimes putting our responders in a no win situation by sending them unequiped for the situation.
The example of the police officer on scene when a civilian brigns out a victim needing CPR is one thing. But the public expects all responders to just do something. They do not understand why that police officer is not running in and trying to rescue all those people. This has lead to a culture where we have trained police officers to disregard their own safety. Why do firefighters wear turnout gear? Because years of science have told us it is the best way not to get burned. Why do police run into burning buildings? Because the fire department was not there yet. To this I will ask why were the police there? As a dispatcher I can wait a few seconds for the fire department to be alerted before sending the police to a call where their main function will be support, especially in a world where most fire responses are under 5 minutes.

From the dispatch persepective I have always wondered why we send agencies to other agencie's calls. In my dispatch center a call for a structure fire automatically goes to both the police and fire dispatchers. By the very nature of police being out on patrol and fire waiting in a station for a call, it is almost impossible for the police to not arrive first. I often ask this question, why are we sending the police. Most often I get the nebulous answer that they might be needed. By this theory we should send police, fire and EMS on all calls because they might be needed. Do we send EMS on all buglaries because someone might have cut themselves on a broken window? I have been criticized for not sending the dive team to a car partially in the water with the driver standing looking at it, based on the idea that there might have been a body in the trunk. If that were really a concern then fire should be responding to all abandoned cars for the same reason.
Now there are concerns that the police need to deal with at many fire scenes, but none are critical enough that we need to send them well before we have alerted the fire department. THe old joke about the first car having to get there in time to block the hydrant is only sometimes a joke, but I was on a call once where one of our guys had to get out of the tower ladder and move the unattended police car at the end of the block, because the officer parked it across the street then walked up to look at the fire. I get that there are sometimes traffic concerns and there are even times when fires become crime scenes, but I also think that we are sometimes putting our responders in a no win situation by sending them unequiped for the situation.
The example of the police officer on scene when a civilian brigns out a victim needing CPR is one thing. But the public expects all responders to just do something. They do not understand why that police officer is not running in and trying to rescue all those people. This has lead to a culture where we have trained police officers to disregard their own safety. Why do firefighters wear turnout gear? Because years of science have told us it is the best way not to get burned. Why do police run into burning buildings? Because the fire department was not there yet. To this I will ask why were the police there? As a dispatcher I can wait a few seconds for the fire department to be alerted before sending the police to a call where their main function will be support, especially in a world where most fire responses are under 5 minutes.