Protester Dangling Beneath Tappan Zee Bridge

[Pedro911 22]

well done

Edited November 7, 2011 by Pedro911

[helicopper 1,050]

It was originally reported that a NYSP helicopter landed in the SB lanes to drop of the MRT. Is this true? Also, what marine units were on scene? Heard Ossining, Yonkers and County PD were on scene. Anyone else?

They landed at least twice on the west side of the bridge near the toll plaza.

The Thruway Authority boat was also there.

[OnTheWheel 43]

NYSP boat on scene as well.

[helicopper 1,050]

NYSP boat on scene as well.

Did they fly that down from Albany also???

[OnTheWheel 43]

Did they fly that down from Albany also???

LOL it was already there so I didnt see its arrival. They did have 2 choppers in old gm plant lot.

[Bnechis 3,961]

This is not a difficult or dangerous rescue for a well trained rescue team.

You attach a lowering system and a short haul system to his rigging. Lift him up about 6" or a foot and disconnect his rigging from the bridge, then lower away.

Simple, safe and easy

And sounds like thats what was done.

[Bnechis 3,961]

Did they fly that down from Albany also???

[Guest alsfirefighter]

This is not a difficult or dangerous rescue for a well trained rescue team.

You attach a lowering system and a short haul system to his rigging. Lift him up about 6" or a foot and disconnect his rigging from the bridge, then lower away.

Simple, safe and easy

And sounds like thats what was done.

Was thinking the same thing Barry...with the exception of that this is a law enforcement matter...

[Bnechis 3,961]

Was thinking the same thing Barry...with the exception of that this is a law enforcement matter...

Thats why you lower into a police boat.....

[AMISHFF 26]

Why does the NYS police have to fly troopers in when they can call for mutual aid from places like Greenburgh PD, Yonkers ESU, NYPD ESU, etc. All have rope rescue capabilities and if it is a law enforcement issue why not get them for support and have a unified command. The last incident the guy had a knife and the troopers had thruway authority personel handcuff the guy. Sounds crazy in these days and times. Greenburgh Tech rescue has cops and firemen on the team and are well trained. Use the cops to deal with the suspect and the rest of the team to do support. Flying people in from all over the state is ridiculous when you have local resources and a mutual aid plan that can be formed. It is done in the fire service everyday maybe the troopers can take a page from our playbook. Nice job very professionally done today, glad no emergency personel got hurt.

[INIT915 1,119]

The last incident the guy had a knife and the troopers had thruway authority personel handcuff the guy. Sounds crazy in these days and times.

Source of this?

[Guest alsfirefighter]

Thats why you lower into a police boat.....

No that's why you let police handle police matters.

[peterose313 345]

This is not a difficult or dangerous rescue for a well trained rescue team.

You attach a lowering system and a short haul system to his rigging. Lift him up about 6" or a foot and disconnect his rigging from the bridge, then lower away.

Simple, safe and easy

And sounds like thats what was done.

His rigging was a rope ladder attached to his van though, does that change things or no?

[peterose313 345]

Source of this?

That was recently, an odd duty p.o. in an unmarked car was the one to find him. It was in local media, believe lohud had an article.

[ny10570 745]

His rigging was a rope ladder attached to his van though, does that change things or no?

Not really. Just need to give him a harness first before attaching him to your line.

[JJB531 652]

Why does the NYS police have to fly troopers in when they can call for mutual aid from places like Greenburgh PD, Yonkers ESU, NYPD ESU, etc. All have rope rescue capabilities and if it is a law enforcement issue why not get them for support and have a unified command. The last incident the guy had a knife and the troopers had thruway authority personel handcuff the guy. Sounds crazy in these days and times. Greenburgh Tech rescue has cops and firemen on the team and are well trained. Use the cops to deal with the suspect and the rest of the team to do support. Flying people in from all over the state is ridiculous when you have local resources and a mutual aid plan that can be formed. It is done in the fire service everyday maybe the troopers can take a page from our playbook. Nice job very professionally done today, glad no emergency personel got hurt.

The Tappan Zee Bridge is New York State Police jurisdiction, not NYPD, not Greenburgh. NYPD should not have to deplete their resources in the Bronx/Manhattan to handle a job that can be obviously handled by the State Police in their own jurisdiction. How many Tech Rescue members of Greenburgh PD were working the day tour today? How many would have to be called in from home to handle this job? Would there be any time saving benefit to having Tech Rescue trained Police Officers from Greenburgh first drive in from their homes to GPD HQ, suit up, and drive to the Tappan Zee Bridge, or just fly in on-duty MRT Troopers to deal with a situation in their jurisdiction?

[JJB531 652]

That was recently, an odd duty p.o. in an unmarked car was the one to find him. It was in local media, believe lohud had an article.

That doesn't answer INIT915's question. Yes, an OFF duty Police Officer from Yonkers was involved in this incident, but INIT915 is questioning the original posters contention that a Thruway Authority worker handcuffed an EDP who was armed with a knife after the EDP was tased by responding Troopers... a claim that I too find hard to believe and inaccurate, hence the reason INIT915 has questioned the posters assertions that this is in fact what happened.

[Bnechis 3,961]

Not really. Just need to give him a harness first before attaching him to your line.

I agree that it does not change anything (it may make it easier, because its not attached to just the edge and you have some working room.

It is highly unlikely that he will put on a harness. There are some very good specialty victim harness out there that work nicely, most standard harnesses would put this victim in more danger if he tried to slip it on while dangling.

[ny10570 745]

absolutely. A simple sling harness or if he's compliant and relaxed a clip on seat harness would be very doable.

[AMISHFF 26]

The Tappan Zee Bridge is New York State Police jurisdiction, not NYPD, not Greenburgh. NYPD should not have to deplete their resources in the Bronx/Manhattan to handle a job that can be obviously handled by the State Police in their own jurisdiction. How many Tech Rescue members of Greenburgh PD were working the day tour today? How many would have to be called in from home to handle this job? Would there be any time saving benefit to having Tech Rescue trained Police Officers from Greenburgh first drive in from their homes to GPD HQ, suit up, and drive to the Tappan Zee Bridge, or just fly in on-duty MRT Troopers to deal with a situation in their jurisdiction?

I believe Greenburgh Tech rescue is comprised of members of the pd and fd in Hartsdale, Fairview and Greenville, during a day tour which this occurred, mobilizing a team would not be so difficult I would imagine. I am sure someone on here can clarify there resources. They already provide coverage to Tarrytown and they provide medics as a regular response to the bridge. As for mutual aid from an agency close by. Why not have those agreements in place to at least start and provide adequate assistance to a scene. Your question about calling people in from home goes both ways. How many MRT troopers were working? where were they? did they have to come from home? As far as he NYPD the only reason they were mentioned is there experience in these types of incidents. Anyone who watches and reads the news see's them dealing with all types of protester situations. We have mutual aid agreements for jumpers and other fire related incidents that work very well on the bridge.

The thruway authority workers have over extended themselves for many years assisting in many dangerous rescue situations. Members who respond to the bridge have seen them assist fire and law enforcement many times over the rail and the super structure due to there experience and comfort in dealing with heights and the dangers of the bridge and its various changing conditions due to construction. I think over time we have all assisted law enforcement when things get out of hand and thats what happened at the other incident. People working together for a common goal and a positive result so everyone goes home safely.

Edited November 8, 2011 by AMISHFF

[INIT915 1,119]

As for mutual aid from an agency close by. Why not have those agreements in place to at least start and provide adequate assistance to a scene. Your question about calling people in from home goes both ways. How many MRT troopers were working? where were they? did they have to come from home?

MRT is a full-time unit based at Stewart in the same quarters as Aviation Command. Helicopper can probably better answer this, but what would the response time be to get airborne and travel from Stewart to the Bridge? 15-20 Minutes? More, less?

You didn't answer my question yet? You stated T-Way workers were forced to handcuff the last EDP with a knife. Please elaborate and cite sources.

[JJB531 652]

I believe Greenburgh Tech rescue is comprised of members of the pd and fd in Hartsdale, Fairview and Greenville, during a day tour which this occurred, mobilizing a team would not be so difficult I would imagine. I am sure someone on here can clarify there resources. They already provide coverage to Tarrytown and they provide medics as a regular response to the bridge. As for mutual aid from an agency close by. Why not have those agreements in place to at least start and provide adequate assistance to a scene. Your question about calling people in from home goes both ways. How many MRT troopers were working? where were they? did they have to come from home? As far as he NYPD the only reason they were mentioned is there experience in these types of incidents. Anyone who watches and reads the news see's them dealing with all types of protester situations. We have mutual aid agreements for jumpers and other fire related incidents that work very well on the bridge.

The thruway authority workers have over extended themselves for many years assisting in many dangerous rescue situations. Members who respond to the bridge have seen them assist fire and law enforcement many times over the rail and the super structure due to there experience and comfort in dealing with heights and the dangers of the bridge and its various changing conditions due to construction. I think over time we have all assisted law enforcement when things get out of hand and thats what happened at the other incident. People working together for a common goal and a positive result so everyone goes home safely.

I believe INIT915 answered your question regarding the number of MRT Troopers working. A full time unit, with the training and knowledge to handle this type of incident, out of Stewart with a 20 minute ETA to the scene. Not too shabby if you ask me. Yes the NYPD has experience in these type of incidents, but plain and simple has enough of their own work with protestors right now to be tasked with handling someone elses problem. While I have no doubt the members of the NYPD would have been more then willing to come and assist with this type of incident, the State Police MRT Troopers are hightly trained, hightly motivated, highly competent, and highly capable of handling this type of situation that was occurring in their own jurisdiction, and if they needed the help from an outside agency, they would have called for it.

Correct the Thruway Authority workers have made grabs from the bridge before, and they're comfortable working at heights, and are familiar with the architecture of the bridge itself, along with the dangers associated with it. But I highly doubt many of these Transit Authority workers are trained, experienced, or comfortable in dealing with an EDP who is now armed with an edged weapon. This is where I have a slightly difficult time believing that a civilian Thruway Authority worker jumped in the middle of several troopers who just tased an EDP who was in possession of an edged weapon and handcuffed this individual.

[peterose313 345]

That doesn't answer INIT915's question. Yes, an OFF duty Police Officer from Yonkers was involved in this incident, but INIT915 is questioning the original posters contention that a Thruway Authority worker handcuffed an EDP who was armed with a knife after the EDP was tased by responding Troopers... a claim that I too find hard to believe and inaccurate, hence the reason INIT915 has questioned the posters assertions that this is in fact what happened.

Man with knife Tasered after threatening to jump from Tappan Zee

Yonkers cop recounts helping save distraught man on Tappan Zee Bridge

This should answer your question. The despondent man began cutting himself with said knife which is when Troopers tased him and pulled him over to safety. Neither says anything about him being handcuffed or about a Thruway worker pulling him over.I would highly doubt that it would be a Thruway Authority worker who would have handcuffed him too, if anything it would have been a trooper who would have done it. Unless I'm misunderstanding here...

Edited November 8, 2011 by peterose313

[JJB531 652]

Man with knife Tasered after threatening to jump from Tappan Zee

Yonkers cop recounts helping save distraught man on Tappan Zee Bridge

This should answer your question. The despondent man began cutting himself with said knife which is when Troopers tased him and pulled him over. Neither says anything about him being handcuffed specifically, likely because he was taken to hospital first.

Thank you for the link, but I read the lohud article when it was originally written. It really doesn't answer any questions I have, because I already know the answer to the questions that have posed to the original poster. This is more about clarifying inaccurate information being distributed without any evidence or proof of claims made that civilian workers are out there handcuffing armed EDP's post-deployment of a conducted energy device.

EDP's who go to the hospital are routinely handcuffed by law enforcement, especially when they have shown a propensity for violence or their actions have led law enforcement to take more aggressive measures of the force continuum to bring them into custody. New York State Mental Health Law empowers Law Enforcement Officers to restrain (handcuff) individuals who have a propensity of violence or are likely to cause harm to themselves or others. Since this individual clearly fit that category, the fact that this individual went to the hospital for evaluation doesn't automatically negate him from being handcuffed.

[efdcapt115 1,511]

The answer is very simple: Troopers don't want local PD's responding to an incident at 120 mph (just look at the FHP/Miami debacle) You gotta know this is a just a kiddin'

[SOUSGT 357]

Did they fly that down from Albany also???

Nah, FedEx:

When it positively has to be there on time.

Or so they say!

[velcroMedic1987 330]

Why does the NYS police have to fly troopers in when they can call for mutual aid from places like Greenburgh PD, Yonkers ESU, NYPD ESU, etc. All have rope rescue capabilities and if it is a law enforcement issue why not get them for support and have a unified command. The last incident the guy had a knife and the troopers had thruway authority personel handcuff the guy. Sounds crazy in these days and times. Greenburgh Tech rescue has cops and firemen on the team and are well trained. Use the cops to deal with the suspect and the rest of the team to do support. Flying people in from all over the state is ridiculous when you have local resources and a mutual aid plan that can be formed. It is done in the fire service everyday maybe the troopers can take a page from our playbook. Nice job very professionally done today, glad no emergency personel got hurt.

Why? Because they're the State Police and don't need anyone else's help.

Unified Command? The State Police doesn't do unified command. They're the State Police.

Flying people from Albany is ridiculous when you have Westchester County, Greenburgh, Yonkers, Mount Vernon and White Plains all within minutes but that's not how the State operates.

Calling for help would be admitting that they are spread too thin and like everyone else are doing more with less. They have to maintain the illusion that they are the great Oz and you're not allowed to look behind the curtain.

[peterose313 345]

Thank you for the link, but I read the lohud article when it was originally written. It really doesn't answer any questions I have, because I already know the answer to the questions that have posed to the original poster. This is more about clarifying inaccurate information being distributed without any evidence or proof of claims made that civilian workers are out there handcuffing armed EDP's post-deployment of a conducted energy device.

EDP's who go to the hospital are routinely handcuffed by law enforcement, especially when they have shown a propensity for violence or their actions have led law enforcement to take more aggressive measures of the force continuum to bring them into custody. New York State Mental Health Law empowers Law Enforcement Officers to restrain (handcuff) individuals who have a propensity of violence or are likely to cause harm to themselves or others. Since this individual clearly fit that category, the fact that this individual went to the hospital for evaluation doesn't automatically negate him from being handcuffed.

In that case, I got nothin. Sorry?

[INIT915 1,119]

Why? Because they're the State Police and don't need anyone else's help.

Unified Command? The State Police doesn't do unified command. They're the State Police.

Flying people from Albany is ridiculous when you have Westchester County, Greenburgh, Yonkers, Mount Vernon and White Plains all within minutes but that's not how the State operates.

Calling for help would be admitting that they are spread too thin and like everyone else are doing more with less. They have to maintain the illusion that they are the great Oz and you're not allowed to look behind the curtain.

Great! Now I feel like all the UC's I've been part of were a waste of my time!

[Bull McCaffrey 162]

Who cares who cuffed the guy? They talked him down and got him into custody with no injuries to MOS or Thruway workers. As far as the dude dangling from the bridge, this is much ado about nothing. These things happen on a weekly basis down in Manhattan alone. Whether it's a high rise construction accident or some nut job perched on the 89th floor of some building, there is always something high angle going on. Sometimes so high up that the people on the ground don't even notice the incident. It gets handled, no fanfare, no fuss end of story.

Keep in mind also that this was a "standoff" if you will. Not really an emergency, imminent life or death situation. This guy put HIMSELF there and he WANTED to be there. I don't see response time here being a huge factor. Had they needed people there quicker, I'm sure that the Troopers would have requested help from Yonkers, Greenburg or White Plains. Kudos on the troopers for handling their own.